Fat Wives Demanding Unconditional Love

Let’s not beat around the bush, female obesity is a major boner killer to the majority of men. Men being married to someone they have no sexual interest in, amounts to living in a very private hell. I’ve had a few emails recently about husbands trying to get their wives to lose weight. Mostly they are doing the right thing and making sure their Sex Rank is as high as they can get it.
One husband told me he felt he was in great shape, a good job, helps with the house and kids. Pegged himself as an 8. His wife he thought was a 5 due mainly to her ballooning figure. When he asked her to lose the weight she was enraged and cut him off from sex for a year. He was very frustrated and angry about it, but he stuck around and tolerated it.
So if you think you’re an 8, and your 5 wife cuts you off from sex for a year, and you tolerate it, you are in fact acting like a 4.
It’s tempting to frame the wife as delusional and thinking she really is an 8 or 9 herself, but deep down she knows she really isn’t hot. She knows she’s a 5, but is bluffing that she is an 8.
It’s tempting to say that the husband is McWeaksauce and not an 8 and is in fact a 4, but really he’s just playing his hand purposely badly and letting her win to keep the relationship stable.
The reality is they are locked in a pattern of allowing her to have total control of the relationship, by the husband’s purposeful choice to defer to her. The reality is that he is an 8 and she is a 5. So as soon as he decides to stop deferring to her, and call her bluff, the relationship will immediately destabilize and reform in a different pattern of interaction.
An 8 with a 5 relationship is extremely unbalanced and risks serious chance that the 8 will find someone better, or the 5 will simply flip out and leave before “the inevitable” happens. So you obviously have to manage that and allow time for the fat 5 to become a fit 6, a trim 7 and then an elegant 8.
When you make it clear that the weight issue is bad enough to make you have zero attraction to her and you are now ready to start doing something other than just tolerating it, you will run into a huge Fitness Test. This will usually come in the form of a top of the lungs screaming statement that as your wife, she is entitled to unconditional love from you. Her friends and family… and possibly also your friends and family will pile on with that as well.
If you back down at this point, you’re toast. You’ll be owned by her forever as her eunuch. Things will be worse in that she will up the ante on her bluff and ensure that you are routinely shamed to remind you to not challenge her authority in the relationship. But unconditional love does kinda sound like a good thing doesn’t it… if you’re a Nice Guy that’s like kyptonite.
You need to realize that she’s actually telling you she’s not good enough for you. Anyone screaming for unconditional love, knows they don’t meet the conditions. And yes, damn straight marriage has conditions. Watch how fast the shit hits the fan if you suddenly decide to quit your good job to become an unemployed drunk. If you started hitting her a couple times a week, would you convince her not to call the police because she needs to love you unconditionally and just accept you are you are? Marriage has conditions. Only spouses that suck demand unconditional love.
Here’s what you say…
“This is your fair warning, and the only one you will ever get. I am going to be with someone I am attracted to. I would like that woman to be you. If you would like to be that woman, I will help you become what you can be. If you don’t want to be that woman… that is your choice.”
Then the next 24 hours or so she has a emotional meltdown and after it passes, she’ll very probably break out the exercise clothes and get started. Though I do warn you that your Sex Rank must be higher than hers to try this sort of thing.

Comments

  1. Anonymous says:

    Yep, hit it on the head. I am already thinking of ways to get this baby weight off once the baby comes. I don't fancy that part of it…but I don't want to lose my husband's attention either.

    Sarah.

  2. Anonymous says:

    Before giving that 'fair warning', please, please, please PLEASE! take steps to protect yourself financially and, if possible, legally. Otherwise you may end up buggered without lubricant by a vengeful spouse and enabling legal system.

    You have been warned.

  3. Anonymous says:

    When you make it clear that the weight issue is bad enough to make you have zero attraction to her and you are now ready to start doing something other than just tolerating it, you will run into a huge Fitness Test.

    If you are going to threaten to leave her because of her weight, you have to mean it. It's not obvious that that's the right thing to do – particularly if you have kids.

  4. The Outsider says:

    The elephant in the room with Athol's (fantastic) blog is that if you're married already and especially if you have kids it may be too late. In a real sense, you *are* a four, no matter what your rank would be on the market. Although you may be able to trade up for a better wife, it's much harder to trade up for a better life.

    That would be true even if divorce were a fair proposition instead of the man-bashing farce it is. It's hard not to be bluffing when you give your wife an ultimatum if there are kids involved.

    The "How to choose a wife" post should be required reading for all sixteen-year-old boys

  5. Wow. I'm almost speechless. While I'm blown away that you are equating obesity and domestic violence, I really want to comment on the ultimatum speech. I would hope that some counseling was suggested and tried before that ultimatum. Rather than the wife deciding to lose weight as a result of the ultimatum, it is more likely that she'd kick the guy out because he's an insensitive jerk, THEN lose the weight for some other guy. And in the divorce, how likely would she be to agree to a favorable custody arrangement for the kids? I don't disagree that it is an important issue. It is, but giving an ultimatum like that to someone you supposedly love is just wrong. There's a difference between leaving someone because they beat you and endanger your life and leaving someone because they are not sexually attractive to you anymore and you're not getting enough sex. If you can't see that, then you've got a much bigger problem than a fat wife.

  6. Anonymous says:

    Waiting for her to deny sex is the problem. He should deny her sex first, but in an obvious enough way that she knows why. And not with an embarrassed hangdog sort of body language. I mean, a man must have standards.

    If you are going to threaten to leave her because of her weight, you have to mean it. It's not obvious that that's the right thing to do – particularly if you have kids.

    The kids thing does make it difficult. Aren't there a few somewhat less…nuclear options? For example, if the man is the breadwinner, he can just tell her he is not paying for junk food anymore; it's for her and the family's own good. And he will drop her from the insurance policy pronto unless she gets back in shape. Paleo diet, here we come.

    Or how about this one: if he is buff enough to pull it off, just tell her she is not welcome in the bedroom until things improve. Replace the bed with a single cot large enough for him and let her find a place to sleep elsewhere in the house. I mean… he's supposed to get unconditional love anyway, right? Let her explain to others why she sleeps on the couch.

    The main thing is, wherever your plant your flag, stick by it, don't let shamers move you. If you've made it clear that you are not paying for junk food anymore, then when she buys it, carelessly pluck it from her hands and put it right in the trash compactor. Don't get worked up about it; just do it.

  7. Anonymous says:

    Kat, calling a man an "insensitive jerk" because he refuses to be robbed of a sex life is exactly the problem with modern Western thinking. There's nothing insensitive nor 'jerk' about it. It is simply one's due in marriage. In fact, what the man is actually saying is "I love you enough to care". Trust me, a man who doesn't care whether his wife gets tubby is either gay, or having an affair (or three). And, what a woman is saying by gaining a lot of weight is very clearly "you don't matter enough to me to be worth the bother." (or perhaps even "this is my way of punishing you for not being the man I secretly want you to be.")

  8. Anonymous says:

    Oh wait… you're *that* Kat. Ignore everything I said.

  9. Anonymous says:

    Given Kat's 'female perspective', I repeat my warning:

    "(first) take steps to protect yourself financially and, if possible, legally. "

  10. Anon 2:29 – I wasn't saying that such a man would be an insensitive jerk for wanting and/or expecting regular sex, but that she would see him as an insensitive jerk for giving her an ultimatum like the one in the post.

    Anon

  11. Anonymous says:

    From Kat's blog it sounds like she's not so into fidelity herself.

  12. Anonymous says:

    You make an ultimatum. YOU lose your home and your financial security. YOU get to see your kids at Micky D's once a fortnight, and have them grow up hearing that YOU were the only arsehole in the relationship. YOU never get to go to their weddings / see any grandkids etc.

    YOU have no cards in your hand, and even though Luke said "sometimes nothing is a cool hand", that was a film. Real life isn't like that.

  13. Athol Kay says:

    Kat – you're basically giving us the "Unconditional Love" speech.

    The options for dealing with being married to a poor sexual partner are;

    1. Just tolerate it and be miserable.
    2. Cheat on them.
    3. Leave the relationship.
    4. Push to an ultimatium and either have them return to good form, or end the relationship.

    The husband in question was also turning down offers for sex from other women. I hardly think he was insenstive.

    If you thought his post was insenstive, wait until tonights… :->

  14. Athol Kay says:

    Oh – and that final line can probably be misunderstood as a threat toward you Kat. The post is not going to be about you.

  15. Anonymous says:

    The success of dealing with your significant other's weight problem is largely dependent on your significant other. Number one issue: she has to actually give a shit whether or not you are attracted to her. I hate to say it, but I know many women who just don't care anymore. Number two: the ultimatum shouldn't be pulled out on the first discussion. My boyfriend and I had this conversation – he said that he loved me and was attracted to me but would be much more attracted to me if I lost weight. I asked him what he would do if I said I didn't care (which I do), and he said, "That would be a problem." That was enough for me to understand exactly what he meant without him having to give me an ultimatum. He's been very supportive, and I'm 35lbs lighter as of right now. Number three: tone matters. Make sure she knows that it's out of concern for her health and the health of your relationship that you are bringing this up, and try to sound as understanding as possible. Number four: realize that changing bad habits can be extremely difficult – do what you can to help her out. If she likes to get buttered popcorn when you go to the movies, find something else to do together that doesn't involve food. Get her a subscription to Cooking Light. Go for walks together.

    Just some food for thought ;)

  16. Anonymous says:

    He should remember, too, that obesity is not exactly an easy fight. It's much harder for most women to lose weight than for most men, because women's bodies naturally have more fat on them at any weight, and for a large percentage of people, even successful weight-loss is temporary.

    There are various medical issues and drugs that might contribute to obesity, aside from just lifestyle, diet, and the effects of aging. While some doctors are knowledgeable and sensitive about these issues, many are not.

    For some people, losing weight is relatively straightforward; for others, it is a virtually unwinnable battle against their own biology.

  17. Anonymous says:

    "And in the divorce, how likely would she be to agree to a favorable custody arrangement for the kids? I don't disagree that it is an important issue. It is, but giving an ultimatum like that to someone you supposedly love is just wrong."

    ————-

    Wow.

    It didn't take long before we got a threat of a government-sponsored ass-raping by the legal system. Who's using the nuclear option now?

    Kat has an interesting idea of what is "just wrong" in this world. Threatening to use Sheriff's deputies and Child Protective Services officers to enforce a court order to strip a man of access to his children, merely because he said some sharp words to his fat wife about her fatness, qualifies as "just wrong" in my book.

  18. Looking Glass says:

    Hrmm… "unconditional love" strikes me as a generally religious concept, likely they're "somewhat" Christian in that regard. There's plenty of scripture to throw at the situation (try 1 Corinthians 7, that'll cover most of it).

    For the more generic case, a few thoughts, maybe they lead somewhere.

    - There's "a few pounds" (by which we mean 30) and then "dough boy look" (by which we mean 100+). How this issue effects things is going to depend a bit on that number.

    - Dropping down to a reasonable weight isn't hard, unless your hormones are completely screwed up (which you can have checked easily). Being a Bikini model *is* hard. There's a difference.

    - If the guy was denied sex for a year, then he's been failing a *whole* lot of other tests. While this might be the big one with his wife, I really doubt that's the only issue. While all of the issues likely do come into the issue of sex, I really doubt that's all of it.

    - Since it obviously seems necessary to reestablish order around the house, I might suggest this approach: Just take the whole family Paleo.

    While I do have a few concerns on the Paleo Diet as a totality, it's solid enough (and you can get enough books on it), to just go whole hog. Set it as "this is simply what this family is doing", get rid of basically all the food and get new food. Then take the family out running or some physical activity, but no one goes that isn't participating. Do that 3 days a week.

    That should reorder most of the family's dynamic, if you don't want to go all the way to the big guns. (Oddly enough, after about a year of the 3 days a week activity with the kids, you'd pretty much setup the kids would resent their mother if she filed for divorce, go figure)

    And I really don't get where this strange idea of "unconditional love" stems from. Thinking through my Christian Theology, the only thing I can come up with would revolve around the concept of "Grace", but you could still argue there is a condition on it. (You have to ask to be forgiven, it's not just given with 0 action) What a strange thing the concept really is, and how we got this stuck in part of our culture would make for a good Master's level thesis, actually.

  19. Looking Glass says:

    One little side bit to "holding your ground."

    Most people know this as "enforcing boundaries", but they've rarely noticed it in real life. We tend to just accept & assume certain boundaries without ever actually thinking or discussing them.

    When a boundary isn't enforced, it becomes a precedent. Once it's become precedent, it becomes harder to correct, as it's now just assumed that is the way things will work. Think of the way you stand in any line. Why don't you just cut to the front? You don't because it's generally assumed that "first there, first in" and those that cut are "cheating". Have you actually heard anyone say that to a person over age 6? Likely not, as you learn early in life not to do that, as it turns out to be less effective most of the time (and people respond negatively when you do).

    A Fitness/Shit test can, on several fronts, be considered a Boundary Test. They are "status" checks inside the relationship. When you do not hold a major one, you are devalued and the relationship takes on a new dynamic where, in that area, she has the power to dictate terms. This is why, over a time, spouses can get away with things in a Marriage that might lead you to homicidal rage if anyone else did it to you, but you've taught yourself to accept that dynamic.

    A lot of the problem with Roissy's classic "Beta Male" is that, on the important issues, he's deferring to his significant other. The Beta Male is trading "a little less pain" for "a little less trouble" in each of his major decisions, but those add up and actually destabilize the relationship each time it happens.

    It's the classic issue of avoiding some trouble now and dealing with a lot of trouble later. If kids are raised this way, they turn out to be terrors. By the same method, a man that isn't enforcing his boundaries inside the relationship turns his woman, in the context of the relationship, into that terror as well. Inhibition, for any reason, leads to great folly. That applies inside relationships as well.

  20. Anonymous says:

    "It didn't take long before we got a threat of a government-sponsored ass-raping by the legal system. Who's using the nuclear option now?"

    Indeed, so again I repeat the warning (see above).

    Kat (and others like her) need to learn that some men won't just set themselves on fire, with all that implies.

    You know what I am talking about.

  21. Stingray says:

    Kat,

    There is no comparison of being fat to domestic violence. It is in reaction to her unconditional love speech. If she is really going to throw out that bomb, the husband can throw out whatever bomb he wants in return. There are simply no "conditions" if that is seriously the road she wants to travel down. He could just as easily have said sex with Umpa Loompas as she should love him unconditionally in return, no matter what he does.

    I think that would be an excellent tact for the husband to take. If what we have here is unconditional love, then I still love you fat and you still love me. However, I do not want sex with you any more so I will go elsewhere for that and come to you for love. Might be a good way to wake her up a bit. Harsh? Yes, but so is that unconditional love crap.

  22. Anonymous says:

    Losing weight is very difficult, if you don't know how. I did it, but not because my husband was nagging me; one of the things I love about him is that he loves me as I am (even when I don't myself, at times, and now I'm getting teary-eyed). I lost the weight by eating very little on alternate days (much easier than limiting yourself all the time), but now I'm convinced that low-carb is the better way. I've been eating low-carb for a month now, and I've kept the weight off *while eating to satiety every day*. Read Gary Taubes' book "Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It" to learn how it works.

  23. Anonymous says:

    Fat is a turn off period. My husband is very good looking but about 30-40 pounds overweight. He is making some efforts at least. I hate to say it, but I find it really disgusting, as I am in very good shape. I have said outright that he will have much better sex, and even more frequent, if he loses the bulk, and that I would be much more turned on if he would just lose it, but it falls on deaf ears. I have a very healthy libido, so we have pretty frequent sex, but it's not the kind that I would prefer.

  24. Stingray says:

    Anon 9:43,

    I think it is different for men. This is anecdotal but I think there some truth to it. I heard somewhere that men see themselves in the mirror just as they were at 18 and think, "Damn I still got it." I asked my husband about this and he said, "Yep, that is pretty much true." I don't think men start to see it like we do until they are far more than 30-40 lbs overweight. Makes it a tough situation for you.

  25. Anonymous says:

    @Stingray

    That may be it. My husband is very charming and flirty, but I just haven't been able to make him understand how important this is to me. I don't want any other men-I want him, healthy just no gross stomach bulk. I don't need him to be muscular-just not fat.It literally disgusts me to have his stomach on me. I haven't used the word "disgust" with him though.

  26. Anonymous says:

    Speaking of Paleo, you could take the approach of paleo doc Dr. Jack Kruse:
    "This may sound harsh……but if youre not married……dump her. It may get her to realize how important it is for you and for her. I was married and made my wife and daughter move out for a weekend about three years ago. And it worked. Now they both say that if I did not go that extreme they would have never thought about changing themselves."

    http://paleohacks.com/questions/49885/how-do-i-keep-from-feeling-upset-with-my-girlfriend-when-she-makes-awful-choices/49905#49905

    pretty alpha, but pretty risky. I can see that going very badly.

  27. @Kat "I'm blown away that you are equating obesity and domestic violence…"

    Kat, nobody equated obesity and domestic violence. Athol used domestic violence as an illustration of how the "unconditional love" argument is nonsense and then extended that conclusion to obesity.

  28. ""This is your fair warning, and the only one you will ever get. I am going to be with someone I am attracted to."

    So I read this and thought it assholish at first, but now thinking again, no, go with the tough love method. We don't challenge ourselves enough in life. I've seen one of my sisters gradually grow into morbid obesity, she's not happy with herself, there's health problems, and if her super beta husband would stop enabling her and show a little justified anger, I do think the fat tide would start to turn.

    If my husband said your exact same words regarding "fair warning," sure, I'd get pissed, really pissed, but still, it would definitely work.

    Then once I got into the bestest shape possible, I'd dump the mofo for a hotter guy! (kidding)

  29. Anonymous says:

    @Athol, I commented earlier about my husband, but I also want to add that I agree completely with your post. It shocks me how women "let themselves" go. It is not an inevitable part of aging. It's a choice. No matter how fat women try to gussy themselves up with make-up, high heels, fake nails or big hair, they remain totally disgusting looking and by choosing food as their first love, render themselves virtually unf&ckable.

  30. Anonymous says:

    Speaking from the perspective of a "fat wife", losing weight is not difficult. Changing your eating habits for good is the hard part. I have lost weight several times, but after the weight is gone and there are no more "victories to be had", old habits creep back in. My husband has always been very fit, while managing to eat a completely crappy diet. We joke that he must have the metabolism of a little kid, otherwise he would weigh 400 lbs!

    Recently, he and a friend made a bet to see if they could each lose 15 lbs. My husband has never eaten healthy, so he had no idea what to do. I took him to the grocery store and we spent some time reading labels and shopping for produce. He started eating breakfast and lots of fruit, veggies, beans and lean meat. After 2 months, he is down 20 lbs. Guess what? SO AM I!

    I mentioned to him yesterday how easy it has been for me to change my eating habits, because I am simply following him. The kids are making better food choices as well. He told me that he never realized how much crap is really in our food.

    Hubby is the captain and I am a natural born first officer (love that, by the way) so with him leading the way I think that this time the healthy habits are for good.

  31. Anonymous says:

    @Anonymous 12:02, good for you. You can do this-for him and for you. Your body and mind work together. Take good care of both. Enjoy every bite, eat slowly, move your body. Nothing tastes as good as healthy, skinny and sexy feels.

  32. Anonymous says:

    I would probably react to this ultimatum by filing for divorce or telling him to walk if he needs to. I won't be married to the kind of man who gives ultimatums. If you give in to the first one then he will be threatening to leave you every time he wants you to change or do something. There's no point in being married to that guy.

  33. Anonymous says:

    I agree. If my husband gave me that ultimatum. I'd walk. We are a team, partners in our family life. We are raising a family together. A happy, wonderful family, with incredible kids. He's an awesome dad and I'm a fantastic mom. My dh loves me no matter what size I am. In fact, he's told me that whatever size I am is what he ends up finding attractive in other women he sees.

    Now I know someone will say that is bullshit. I don't know. He does want me to lose weight now, and so do I. It has been hard for me for a variety of reasons. Now that I am seeing a specialized doctor for a true medical condition I didn't even know I had, things are really working. I am on a low-carb, high protein diet, feeling great and looking great.

    Part of the reason I married my husband, besides loving him and having such fun with him, is that the sex was out of this world. He was the first person that ever made me climax. That will definitely bond a woman to you. :)

    Now, here's a bunny trail question. What if your husband subtly and not so subtly sabotages your weight loss. When I do start looking pretty good, my husband will start doing this. I think he is worried I'll leave, which is not true. He wants me healthy and hot, but not too hot. He is very, very hot. Easily a 9 or 10 at 40, and women notice.

    He's very committed and I am very committed. I know he would never cheat and blow what we have. So why the insecurity?

  34. Anonymous says:

    "I would probably react to this ultimatum by filing for divorce or telling him to walk if he needs to. I won't be married to the kind of man who gives ultimatums. If you give in to the first one then he will be threatening to leave you every time he wants you to change or do something. There's no point in being married to that guy."

    The woman didn't have sex w/ him for a year! He should have walked after a month. An ultimatum is exactly what is needed. He doesn't want a bff, he wants a spouse. IMHO, no sex is no marriage.
    If she blows up and files for divorce then she just confirmed that the marriage was already a sham in her eyes.

  35. Anonymous says:

    Okay, I'm the anonymous with the hot husband up there. I know sex is important to men, why not just say it is important to him and that you need couples counseling? Then go and figure out what the problems are. If a wife doesn't want to have sex with her husband she's may be either on medication, depressed, or doesn't like her husband (being a jerk doesn't make us wet).

  36. Anonymous says:

    "The woman didn't have sex w/ him for a year! He should have walked after a month. An ultimatum is exactly what is needed. He doesn't want a bff, he wants a spouse. IMHO, no sex is no marriage.
    If she blows up and files for divorce then she just confirmed that the marriage was already a sham in her eyes. "

    He probably told her that he wanted her to lose weight in a way that hurt her feelings and made her feel self conscious about her body. You can't say "I'm grossed out by how fat you are" in one breath and "let's have sex" in the next and expect her to want the sex. He should have tried asking her workout with him, switching to healthier foods ect.

    Even if she loses weight with the ultimatum their marriage won't be a happy one because of the resentment that giving ultimatums causes.He needs to find a better way of getting her to lose weight.

  37. Wow. I'm not sure how to take all this in.

    Is it just me, or does this whole conversation seem totally shallow? Don't get me wrong, I understand that being over weight is bad for your health and unattractive, but doesn't the love and caring you share with your wife make up for some of that? Maybe I'm the odd guy out, but my attraction to me SO isn't solely based on her hot ass. Sure, her hot ass may have grabbed my attention at first, but it was her personality that drew me in and kept me. Even if she did gain weight, I would still be attracted to her.

    I think most men put FAR too much importance on looks and not nearly enough on personal quality. I would much rather spend my life with a woman that has a few extra pounds but has a stellar personality and is comfortable with herslef, than a Victoria's Secret model that is a total bitch.

    Beside, those models are all too scrawny. I don't want to be afraid I would break them during a normal bed session….

  38. I don't think you are as rare as some men think, Alex. :) Your SO is a lucky woman.

    Anonymous here again – decided to identify myself.

  39. Anonymous says:

    About the unconditional love thing – I can see why people want that. No one wants to think that their spouse will leave them if they become ill, age, lose their job, become disabled or whatever. Threatening to leave undermines the sense of security and the feeling of "we're in this together for life".

    I think that a spouse who has been given an ultimatum will be a lot more likely to leave you if you go through a rough patch because she will know that you wouldn't be there for them under the same circumstances.

  40. Dave in the cave says:

    @ALEX

    I hear what you're saying, and agree that some flaws are easily overlooked.

    But until you've been in this situation, you can't say for sure what you would *actually* do. Being stuck looking at more attractive women, getting aroused, and going home to a fat cow that you begrudgingly have sex with can make a man very desperate…

  41. Some of you are completely missing the point. This isn't about a "rough patch" or bad health or depression or anything of the sort. It's not even about being fat. It's about an egotistical woman who wants to control her husband. She has already chosen to poison the relationship. He can stay and commit slow suicide, he can walk, or he can give her a chance to straighten up. Those are the only possible choices. Which one is the most loving?

  42. Jay, why are there only 3 choices? What about marriage counseling and the wife seeing a bariatric doctor (not a surgeon)? Some women find themselves trapped in an eating cycle due to the high carb diet our government recommends.

    I do think that if you are calling your wife a fat cow the marriage has little hope.

  43. All i know is I hope any man that goes this route better be 100% perfect. If was was the wife on the recieving end of this conversation, I'd pick my husband apart like a pack of staRving dogs on a carcass.

    Obviously I don't know the whole story. But I want to believe that my SO would never be so shallow as to threaten to leave me if I was hurt or lost my job.

    Jay C – so your view is that this woman is trying to control her husband by gaining weight? Can you honestly tell me that threatening to leave is NOT an attempt at control by the husband? This seems very sexist and one-sided to me. Is it not possible to simply exist with mutual agreements to treat each other nicely? Does someone always have to defer in order to have a healthy relationship?

  44. This topic is a tough one. I used to resent my husband’s concern with my weight but now I understand that it just is what it is. Men like their women to be physically fit. For my husband to be attracted to me I need to be at most a size 8.

    Men – when you approach your woman with this topic try not to do too much damage. There is the potential to scar her and anyone who’s been married long enough knows how hard it is to overcome big scars. If you aren’t careful she may lose the weight and get the rockin' body you crave but that won’t necessarily turn into everything clicking sexually for you two again. I speak from experience on this one.

    Women – if you want your husband to want you then you have to get and stay in shape. You may not like that bit of reality but just because you don’t like it doesn’t change the fact that it is reality.

  45. Stingray says:

    Lainey said,

    " wife seeing a bariatric doctor (not a surgeon)?"

    That would be a part of one of the three choices. It does not say anywhere that the husband called her a "fat cow". It simply says he asked her to lose weight. Then she cut him off of sex for an entire year. He stuck it out, for 365 days. Who is being more unreasonable here? Is she likely very sensitive about her weight? I am sure she is, but is that really what he deserved? I have to think that this guy is a good husband if he stuck it out. If he is an 8 he probably could have easily cheated as well.

  46. Jack Amok says:

    Sarah,

    No need to wait until after the baby – eat right and get appropriate exercise during your pregnancy. It'll be better all the way around. You'll feel better during the pregancy, delivery will be easier, you'll be on your feet sooner afterwards, and the baby will probably be better off too. Plus, if you just continue the momentum after the baby's born, the baby weight will go away more or less as a matter of course. Get some professional coaching on what appropriate exercises are. Not sure how far along you are or if there are any complications, but unless you're on bed rest, there should be something you can do – my wife did strength training during two of her three pregnancies and she felt much better during those.

    I think one of the mistakes women make is equating being pregnant with being fat. Sure, in both cases you weigh more, and pregnancy does come with increased fat, but they're not the same thing at all. The weight and fat gained during pregnancy are the natural result of the pregnancy and the hormonal changes associated with it. Once the pregnancy is over, the natural state of things reverts back and your body will drop (most) of the weight by itself. If you haven't pick up bad habits…

    I think the biggest problem isn't the weight you put on while pregnant, it's the baby you have after the delivery! It's not as easy to make it to the gym or the Zumba session, and you have a built-in excuse for not doing things. Plus a lot of women go through a mental change from being "wife" to being "mother." The new baby is the center of their universe, and all their energy goes there. They forget they have a husband – he becomes a lackey, responsible for helping out with the baby at her beck and call.

    I think that's an extremely dangerous period for any marriage. It's so easy for the new mother to fall into that trap, and it's so easy for the new father to as well – it's his kid too, he's excited about fatherhood and want's to be a good dad and a supportive husband. Pretty soon, she's turning into a domineering witch and he's degenerated into a spineless wimp…

    Babies need a lot of care and attention. But the thing they need the most is a happily married Mom and Dad. The most important thing you can do for your baby is to remain in love with your husband!

  47. I think he is probably a good husband, too. I hope he would gently take her by the hand and talk about counseling and seeing a good bariatric doctor. There aren't a lot out there. They need to be searched for.

    Also, I was talking about Dave in the cave calling his wife a cow.

    I really don't see the wife as controlling. I just see a woman unable to pull herself out of her unhealthy ways. Counseling really could help her and him. :)

  48. Stingray says:

    Anon 11:01,

    I wish I had some advice for you. That really is a tough one. I would not use the word disgust though. DOes he like to work out? Lift weights? Is it something you could spend time doing together? My husband and I love going to the gym together. It can be a hell of a turn on as well.

  49. Stingray says:

    Lainey,

    Out of curiosity, why do you suggest a bariatric doctor and not diet and exercise? I assume she is not morbidly obese. Being a 5 sounds more overweight than obese to me.

  50. A bariatric doctor will work with her on diet and exercise. If someone is overweight and not depressed it could be a diet or medical issue. There are a lot of people in this country that are insulin resistant – especially women. It is very confusing. We are told that healthy carbs are the foundation for a good diet, but then those very carb turn into excess sugar in the blood, and an insulin problem, which in turn causes people to have uncontrollable cravings for more carbs. In a lot of people it is a biochemistry problem. Once that is fixed, the ability to stay on a healthy high-protein (doesn't have to be meat) low-carb diet and exercise is that much easier, plus the amount of energy increases.

    I have struggled for years with my weight because I was following that damn food pyramid and eating "healthy."

  51. And this gem is the root of the problem for me:

    "But until you've been in this situation, you can't say for sure what you would *actually* do. Being stuck looking at more attractive women, getting aroused, and going home to a fat cow that you begrudgingly have sex with can make a man very desperate…"

    How about going home to the woman you love? The one that knows you like no other woman. The one that has a great smile. The woman that has a personality you simply adore. Not your wife? Then I think you chose badly when you decided to get married. If the ONLY thing holding you to your wife is her looks, you are going to fail. At some point (unless you die young) you are both going to look like hell. Age does that. If the only thing you had was looks, what the hell do you plan on doing with your wife when you can no longer do the things you did when you were young, yes, possibly including sex?

    Besides, all those super hot women turning you on all day are probably stuck up bitches. Ok, probably not, but you get the idea. Fantasizing about a woman you actually don't know is easy. But after you find out she is a self centered twit, her appeal drops quickly.

  52. Stingray says:

    Lainey,

    Been there, done that. Have gone mostly paleo here and have gained more muscle in that time than ever before. Also, feel great. I also used to struggle greatly with my weight. Since I discovered weight lifting and high protein/low carb it is not nearly the struggle it used to be. Why, oh why can't this truth not go mainstream?

  53. Stingray says:

    Alex said,

    "How about going home to the woman you love? The one that knows you like no other woman. The one that has a great smile. The woman that has a personality you simply adore. Not your wife? Then I think you chose badly when you decided to get married. If the ONLY thing holding you to your wife is her looks, you are going to fail. At some point (unless you die young) you are both going to look like hell. Age does that. If the only thing you had was looks, what the hell do you plan on doing with your wife when you can no longer do the things you did when you were young, yes, possibly including sex?"

    I think he does feel these things for his wife or he would not have stuck with her during that year. But, I cannot imagine having this wonderful love for a person and not being attracted to that person. I am sure that he is aware that things will change when they get old, but they are not old yet. It sounds like this guy wants desperately to be attracted to his wife. That is why he is sticking with her and trying to bring back the attraction. This is a marriage, not a relationship between good friends. Attraction is important and he can't bring that attraction on just because he wants it.

  54. Stingray,

    I wish it was more mainstream. So many doctors denigrate the low-carb diet. Even the AHA is too afraid to endorse it. It's okay to change when the change is needed, they will only have egg on their faces the longer they wait to make the recommendation. Too many people are slowly dying thinking they are eating healthy and just can't stick to a diet. Anyway, I'll step off my soapbox. I just know that I am so thankful to the naturopath doctor I see. I'm finally feeling better, and looking better. I also very thankful my husband stuck with me through this. He's a keeper. :)

  55. Stingray said:

    "This is a marriage, not a relationship between good friends. Attraction is important and he can't bring that attraction on just because he wants it."

    My marriage is a relationship between very good friends, with spurts of good sex, fun, laughter, tears, and worries. It's a package deal. We love each other, even when we can't stand the sight of each other, and it happens in every marriage, we keep at it for our kids. Then we dig ourselves out of it and enjoy the happier times that follow. Marriage is an ebb and flow, it isn't always a consistent feeling. Life can be hard, and so can marriage.

  56. Anonymous says:

    This is terrible advice. Unless you married a crazy person, asking someone to lose weight will not "enrage" them. The husband no doubt made some rude comments about her appearance.

    Most of this blog seems to be about men wanting the woman that they are having sex with to passionately want them and not just go through the motions of sex. Well women don't want to have sex with someone who doesn't really want them either. The difference is that men will have sex with a woman who is not that into it while women will usually pass on that. Telling your wife that you don't find her attractive is obviously going to lead to less sex, not more.

    Here is how I got my husband to lose 40 pounds. I flirted with him, complimented him on his appearance and other things, and made love to him frequently and enthusiastically. I cooked healthier meals and asked him to take a walk or a bike ride with me afterward. I asked him to workout with me at the gym and told him that watching him lift weights made me wet. I asked him to wash my back in the shower after we got home from the gym and gave him a bj while we were in there. Now he loves working out like I love shoe shopping. We are both in great shape and I didn't have to torpedo his self esteem or my marriage to get here. This takes more effort then just saying "lose weight or I'll leave you" but it is also a lot more loving, and probably more effective.

    I hope that if I had come at him with some BS ultimatum that he would have had sense enough to drop me for someone who understands that marriage doesn't work that way.

  57. Stephenie Rowling says:

    Wow Athol you stroke a cord! You should make a post about weight once a month :)

    To the women defending fat wife.
    Really? A year with no sex? No one stays upset that long. She made her move first "I have you on a leash and I will punish you" the man needs to up her or she will call her bluff and go for two years without sex. She obviously has enough will power to punish him with sex so she can totally use that gift to lose weight. She doesn't because she knows he will not walk away ever.
    So IMO the man needs to go and leave for a week after the ultimatum (of course taking financial precautions). Not calls, not mails. Then come back home. If she still cares she will realize that she is losing a good thing and try and change, if she doesn't at least he will be free to find a woman that truly appreciates him.
    A year really? I mean a couple of days even a month I could see being because she was upset, but a year nope she is manipulating him because she knows she can. She needs a reality check pronto!

    Kat
    I knew you would hate this advice. How dare you to talk about your sex issues. The solution is to lie and cheat with other people to find the sexual satisfaction you don't have at home…call me.
    Sociopaths are incapable of find any purpose in honesty.

  58. Anonymous said:
    "I hope that if I had come at him with some BS ultimatum that he would have had sense enough to drop me for someone who understands that marriage doesn't work that way."

    I completely agree. Very well put.

  59. Anonymous says:

    No fat chicks!

    I agree that an ultimatum like that is likely to backfire badly in huge flames, if only because the legal deck is so strongly stacked in her favor.
    Most likely scenario is she loses the weight to spite him, then files and hops on the carousel with her new body and his house and money.

    Best chew your leg out of the trap and cut your losses.

  60. Anonymous says:

    How to get your fat wife to lose weight without hurting her feelings:
    1. Love her unconditionally
    2. Watch the kids while she goes to the dr to have her hormones checked.
    3.Watch the kids while she exercises. Make it easy for her to get it done.
    4. Find a physical activity that she enjoys. Learn it with her, and do it together.
    5. Challenge her to a bit of friendly competition in said activity.
    6. Get all the junk out of the house. Don't even bring it in. No, not even YOUR junk. Sugar addicts in desperation will eat anything with sugar in it, even if they hate it.
    7. Support her as she undergoes a huge lifestyle change, mental change, and physical change.

    Athol, your stuff about Alpha/Beta and Captn/First Officer are right on target. But you have no clue about women and weight issues.

  61. Anonymous said:

    "Athol, your stuff about Alpha/Beta and Captn/First Officer are right on target. But you have no clue about women and weight issues."

    I agree, Athol. I love everything else you have written. I also bought your book. But I don't like this article.

  62. Anonymous says:

    By human nature we seek a fit, healthy mate. It is the way we were created to be. When you become a slob, or gain 20lbs etc, you are no longer attractive. You are showing me that your genes are not healthy! JUST SAYING! If you get lazy and gain weight, honestly feels like your giving your special someone the finger. "If I want to gain weight then I will, and you will love me regardless, I dare you to bitch, even if you do I don't care, this is my body, your not important enough."

    awesome!

  63. Jack Amok says:

    "I think most men put FAR too much importance on looks and not nearly enough on personal quality. I would much rather spend my life with a woman that has a few extra pounds but has a stellar personality and is comfortable with herslef, than a Victoria's Secret model that is a total bitch.

    Beside, those models are all too scrawny. I don't want to be afraid I would break them during a normal bed session…. "

    False equivalency trap #4782… Because the average woman could never look as good as a Victoria's Secret model, there's no point in even trying, might as well be 80 lbs overweight and wear dumpy clothes…

    Nobody said she needed to look like Heidi Klum. She just needs to not look like Roseanne Barr.

    Not fair! Not fair! Doesn't he love her? Wah! Wah! Wah!

    Put a cork in it, ladies. Look, it's simiple. Guys like sexy women. Fact of nature. A guy who wants to be faithful to his marriage has agreed not to have sex with any woman other than his wife. So if she's not sexy, he's going to be sad. A wife doing what she can to make herself sexy is doing what she can to make her husband happy.

    Can't have that, now can we.

  64. Athol Kay says:

    Interesting comments, much appreciated all. Minor clarification…

    I have long advised that the use of an ultimatium is a last resort that may or may not work. If you follow my general advice to stop trying to change the other person and self-improve, frequently the other spouse starts pulling themselves together. Often you don't even have an argument about it, the other spouse just becomes interested in changing.

    Classic example: I don't nag Jennifer to exercise. If I start exercising, she tends to follow suit fairly shortly after I do.

    You get forced to an ultimatium when the self-improvement and kind approaches have failed to work. There is always a chance that the relationship will fail because of it, so ultimatiums can only be used for the most critically important matters.

    I can also assure you that the husband in question was distraught with the entire situation. Seeking my advice was his last hope before filing for divorce. Some readers may not like the ultimatium approach, but at least this way she can make a choice about staying in the marriage or not.

    I am looking forward to the response to tonights post….

  65. Stephenie Rowling says:

    "I am looking forward to the response to tonights post…."

    You and Susan are in sink. She made a graph about promiscuity economic cost and man did people flip their shit over that…Really interesting.
    I can imagine that if you are going a similar route with the weight issue you will get the same "hamsters" working over the time. Looking forward to it :)

  66. Wow! Lots of strong opinions. I think this is less about weight, and more about the husband stepping up and being honest about what he wants out of a relationship. He could have said her weight, her smoking, her drinking, her lack of sexual novelty, her love of foreign films. Doesn't matter. What matters is that he is finally stepping up and being honest about what he wants in a relationship, not just laying down and taking whatever she'll give him. The whole idea is to be more alpha- verbalize what you want from your relationship and actively seek it out, don't assume that she will intuit it. If she doesn't turn you on- physically or emotionally- then you should tell her, and explain why. Maybe something can be done about it, maybe not, but that at least allows you as a couple to work on things. No, you can't always have the "perfect" wife/husband, but you can always have someone that continually tries to improve themselves.

  67. @Lainey "Jay, why are there only 3 choices? What about marriage counseling and the wife seeing a bariatric doctor (not a surgeon)?"

    That sounds like option 3 to me.

    @Alex "Jay C – so your view is that this woman is trying to control her husband by gaining weight?"

    No, that's not what I said. She is trying to control him by withholding sex.

    "Can you honestly tell me that threatening to leave is NOT an attempt at control by the husband?"

    No, I can't.

    "Is it not possible to simply exist with mutual agreements to treat each other nicely?"

    No.

    "Does someone always have to defer in order to have a healthy relationship?"

    Yes. This is true for every relationship. Egalitarianism and equal partnerships sound great in unicorn land, but they don't exist in the real world.

  68. "Anonymous said…

    How to get your fat wife to lose weight without hurting her feelings:
    1. Love her unconditionally
    2. Watch the kids while she…"

    This relationship is way beyond that point. The guy's wife has very strong feelings about remaining fat. She is almost certainly an addict to food and probably to other things as well. Addicts do not respond to nice requests. They have to admit they have a problem, then they have to desperately *want* to change, then they have to believe that the pain of changing isn't as bad as the pain of the status quo.

    There is no reasoning in this situation.

  69. Very interesting comments!

    Athol, you wrote "The options for dealing with being married to a poor sexual partner are;

    1. Just tolerate it and be miserable.
    2. Cheat on them.
    3. Leave the relationship.
    4. Push to an ultimatium and either have them return to good form, or end the relationship."

    There's another option – speak up. Talk about it. Get counseling together! It may not work. Someone may choose another option anyway, but it *is* an option.

    Neal – Well said. I agree that it's not so much about weight as communication.

    Jay – I agree with those who have said that any man who refers to his wife as a fat cow has many more problems than an obese wife. He's not worthy of any decent woman.

    Stephanie – I have no objection at all to a couple talking about their sex issues. I think its a good thing. It's the ultimatum in this case that I think is insensitive and, ultimately, counterproductive. It's not the best way for a man to get what he wants – in THIS case. And yeah, I get that you hate me, and *look*, I'm still being polite to you anyway. Quite a concept, huh?

    Alex – Thanks for being the voice that points out that marriage is not all about sex. It's complex, but it comes down to treating the person you chose with respect and decency. It's about love and family.

  70. Oh yeah….someone asked where anyone would get the idea that unconditional love is expected within a marriage. It probably has something to do with that pesky "til death do us part" clause….or maybe it was the "for better or worse" part. If what you really meant is "until I stop getting regular sex from you" or "unless you keep a figure that makes me hot," maybe you should have mentioned that.

    The only possible legitimate reason for the breakup of a marriage is the injury of the partner or the children. Physical self preservation and the safety of the children comes first.

  71. Stephenie Rowling says:

    Kat
    I politely called you a sociopath and you might consider cheating better than having an ultimatum, because that is what you did but it doesn't mean that is better in general. I rather have my husband tell me that we are in the middle of an intolerable situation that endangers our marriage and allow me to decide if I should fight for my marriage or let him be free than having him cheat on me to avoid "hurting my feelings" with an ultimatum. But I'm weird like that I rather handle a hard truth than live a pretty lie. And don't flatter yourself thinking that I hate you. I feel for you (and your cheating husband) nothing but disgust and that is only when you dare to advice people in matters that obviously are not your strength.

  72. Athol Kay says:

    Kat – "There's another option – speak up. Talk about it. Get counseling together! It may not work. Someone may choose another option anyway, but it *is* an option."

    That's close to what option (4) is. And you usually have to work pretty hard to get a spouse that doesn't want to go to counseling into counseling.

    Once you take option (1) off the table by refusing to be taken advantage of anymore, only options (2), (3) and (4) remain. Which only leaves option (4) as anything positive for the other spouse to choose.

  73. Anonymous says:

    Thin Spouse said …

    I’m working through a similar situation. Trust me, there is no “nice” or “easy” way to bring up this topic with your wife. I’ve tried that, as well as dieting together, trying to get her to exercise with me, watching the kids and covering her chores so she can exercise … What does she do? Lie like a lump on the couch. I married my wife expecting that she’d get old and wrinkly; stuff would start to sag; and that she would not be as hot as the 25 year old I married. I’m fine with all that. To my dismay, 5 to 10 pounds a year has added up pretty quickly. I love my wife but I’m not physically attracted to her in her current condition any more than I’d be to toy airplane. I’m just not wired that way. I think that makes me a normal hetero male. As for unconditional love, if she became a drug, alcohol or gambling addict; started abusing the children; etc., I’d stick around and try to help her but there would come a point where I’d pull out the “tough love” ultimatum. Why is this any different? As for the “this is shallow” argument I say, no its not. My relationship with my wife turns on a mental, emotional and physical connection. If one of those connections is broken, it’s a big deal. “Shallow” would be asking her to get breast implants; change her hair; get cosmetic surgery; etc. This is not shallow, it affects the fundamental relationship.

  74. Most husbands go into marriage with the tacit understanding that, one day, their wife is going to look like like she's fifty years old – hopefully because she is. If he's even the slightest bit realistic, he will accept this and work to keep the pair-bond strong so he still loves and is attracted to her at that point. Mentally photoshop her into her 20-year-old body or something, I don't know, I'm not fifty.

    Being fat while still young is a slap in the face to the husband. Any realistic wife will understand that she is needlessly and knowingly gambling with her husband's ability to be attracted to her and to be happy in the marriage, and the only payoff for that gamble is the chance at a few more sweets.

    It's not hard to be thin. Check to see you're getting all your vitamins, then cut your portions in half every other day. Jump rope for ten minutes three times a week. Intake lowered, output raised. Done.

    An ultimatum is not necessarily a dick move. If, as Athol has described, the husband drops an ultimatum after exhausting every possible option for making his wife understand and work with him – after giving up sex for a *year* – then the wife is the one with the lack of empathy. She hears the ultimatum and thinks, "That hurts my feelings!" Not, "What could have happened to make him so hurt he feels an ultimatum is the only recourse?" I'd understand taking the first reaction for 99.9% of the people in the world, but for your own spouse or children, why not try the second one? The latter doesn't even assume any wrongdoing on the ultimatum receiver's part!

    All this nonsense about "Women don't want sex with any man who isn't into sex with them" is BS, and not just because of the (frequently reliable) rule of "never listen to anything a woman says about what she's attracted to." It's because that's exactly what the wife did in response to his first overture about her weight. She responded not just by cutting off sex, but by refusing to fix the source of the problem in the first place. And what did that lead to? If hubby wanted to screw wifey previously, but doesn't now that she's a landwhale, is she entirely free of blame?

    I'd be more sympathetic to women on this issue if it came as a total surprise that men don't generally like sleeping with fat chicks. It's not a big secret, you've seen evidence of it your entire lives. You didn't gain 30 or 50 or 200 pounds overnight; if anything, hubby was giving wifey a lot of credit (too much credit, apparently) by assuming she would catch the problem and deal with it, rather than saying something after the first 10 pounds. So, note to self if I ever marry: say something the very moment I notice something.

  75. Wanderer says:

    "til death do us part" clause….or maybe it was the "for better or worse" part.

    Forgive my ignorance, but aren't those typically religious vows? For those of us who were married before a magistrate rather than a priest (which would apply to the very many of us who aren't Christian or religious, such as, oh, I don't know, our host), the vows would likely be different and possess little of the silly and unrealistic obligations of "unconditional love" you seem to believe men are obligated to.

  76. Anonymous says:

    AK: "I can also assure you that the husband in question was distraught with the entire situation. Seeking my advice was his last hope before filing for divorce. Some readers may not like the ultimatium approach, but at least this way she can make a choice about staying in the marriage or not."

    Athol, I have to disagree with this. If he phrases it like an open ultimatum, he gives her the chance to file for divorce before he does. The person who files first gets to select venue and "frame the story," and it cannot be stressed enough how important those two points are, especially for men who are already at a disadvantage in the family court system.

    IMHO the husband in question should not make an open ultimatum, and should instead make preparations carefully and quietly while not only making his unhappiness known (mostly implicitly, some explicitly) and – important – documenting it. If, unfortunately, it does ultimately head to the divorce courts, then he needs to be the one to file, and not her.

  77. Looking Glass says:

    It should be noted that guys, like the main party in the story of this post, don't end up here unless their Marriage is going horribly. If you have a perfectly functional Marriage, why would a guy end up here? Think about that.

    So, the issue isn't only her weight. That's just the most noticeable one. It's very obvious and when he brought up that it had become a problem, she went nuclear on him. He should have actually kicked her out of the house about a week later, if that continued, but we'll get to that.

    The issue is that she doesn't show him any respect. It's in the body language and body state. If she'd make the Marriage sexless for pointing out the fact that her weight (which is likely more than just a few pounds over weight) is detracting from his Love for her. She responded with MAD-level nuclear warfare. *She* was presented with a problem *she* created inside the relationship then *she* choose to destroy the Marriage. *She* chose to all but legally end the Marriage. That is now *his* problem, and possibly one there's no true solution to saving the Marriage.

    As I said back in my first post in this comments thread, this really isn't just about him getting in shape. She's not respecting him inside the Marriage, which likely means he's been failing shit tests for ages. It just escalated to the point it is at now. His options are very limited in dealing with her now, but his options with other Women obviously isn't limited. He probably got here after stopping a relationship from going to an Affair and is trying to figure out how to save his Marriage.

    So, the guy deserves a Medal. Then a slap up side the head for letting his wife get away with making the Marriage sexless for a year. She was shit testing him and he failed REALLY badly. That's what he's got to fix. There's no way to do it without it being messy.

    Going back to my original post on the subject, I would do the Paleo thing, state what is going to be done then (in the background) have everything ready to drop the Divorce, if needed. The Marriage is on the last legs, if *she* values it, she will respond when it becomes serious. If she doesn't (it's always possible she Married him for the money/stability, I've known someone that happened to), then just send her to her mother's, file for Divorce, and get ready to be "Single Dad" and insist on full custody. If it comes to that point, I'd expect her to respond. If not, you can find someone else that, if you're the full time Parent, will be willing to join in, as you, oddly enough, would have to increase your Alpha quotient to raise kids well.

  78. Aurelian says:

    To the women saying they would walk you were given an ultimatum: if your ass looks like two midgets wrestling under a tarp I would be happy to see your fat ass go.

  79. Anonymous says:

    I'm wondering what kind of pushover or stupid woman you'd have to be married to, to "send her to her mother's" or "put her out of the house". LOL. There is absolutely no way that my husband could put me out of my house without physically removing me. And if he tried that I'd have the police there in 10 minutes to cart him off to his new home at the local jail. And a man can "insist on full custody" all he wants, but unless she is smoking crack out of the baby's bottles he is unlikely to get it. Some of you need to come back to reality.

  80. Let us know when you become a real man Aurelian. I have a real man, an Alpha man, hot, muscled, great dad, wonderful husband, glorious lover. Guys that judge women so harshly won't ever experience the joy and caring he has experienced.

  81. Wanderer says:

    Anonymous above may be right. She's also a shining example of why getting married in the first place is a terrible idea for men. Oh well. I don't care what happens to you, but here's hoping your husband doesn't become the next Thomas Ball.

  82. 1. Look at this post's rating. Fat women may be the majority of this blog's readership.

    2. Check out the shrieking that happens when womens' SMVs (especially the portion that women can do something about) are put under the microscope!

    3. Women don't like Athol's advice. They like him.

    4. Women are not capable of verbalizing what they like, only showing that they like what they're getting.

  83. Wanderer says:

    3. Women don't like Athol's advice. They like him.

    Not to white-knight for our host (or women in general, and Athol, I'm sorry if it seems like I'm being a gratuitous guest, but while I've always been something of a drifter around the 'manosphere,' I've decided to engage it a little more and I find this blog to be one of the best in the vicinity), but judging by how well the advice in his most recent post seemed to have worked, I wonder if women might not find his advice to be as appealing as he is.

    And as for the rating, well, look at it now. ;)

  84. Anonymous—

    If you are going to threaten to leave her because of her weight, you have to mean it. It's not obvious that that's the right thing to do – particularly if you have kids.

    If they have kids and if a wife either won’t have sex with her husband for some extended period of time, or blows up like a sea lion such that he’s not even somewhat attracted to her trying to view her favorably, a husband should have the right, after discussing this with his wife, to seek sexual gratification elsewhere, without this leading her to divorce him, with all that does to the kids.

    She supposed to be giving him sex. He never would have married her if he thought this would be a likely outcome. The least she can do is allow him to seek it elsewhere.

  85. Anonymous says:

    @ Wanderer – I don't know who Thomas Bell is, but if someone thinks that he's going to "put me out" of my own house then he will become inmate number 786752. He has no more right to the house than she does so unless one of them decides to leave freely then neither one of them can put the other out. It's a laughable idea that only a stupid woman would go along with. You'd better advise men to move into the guest room or leave themselves so that they don't get themselves in trouble.

  86. Kat—

    ” While I'm blown away that you are equating obesity and domestic violence,”

    Most so called domestic violence cases where men are arrested for it under VAWA or that middle class women say to their friends in difficult relationship times or at divorce say they’ve suffered is either made up, consisted only of a very overblown fear when they were angry and drunk, or was a trivial return slap, for which women are never arrested. Women actually commit more low level domestic violence against men, men just don’t call 911 over it and even if they do, women are rarely arrested unless a knife or other weapon is involved.

    Even a single black eye is trivial compared to a sexually hungry man never being able to have sex. Only a tiny minority of domestic violence is very serious and it’s almost always done by men lower class men who are otherwise criminals. The amount of feminist lying and vast exaggeration on this subject, in an effort to remove yet another area of male dominance over females, is enormous.

    I’ll say it again. Most incidents of so called domestic violence are trivial. As well when 911 is called the man is hurt by that process vastly more than the great majority of VAWA “victims” were.

  87. Beating up a wife multiple times so that she's frequently in fear is of course very different.

    It's also not at all common among educated middle class and up men, despite feminist efforts to give the contrary impression.

  88. Kat–

    I would hope that some counseling was suggested and tried before that ultimatum. Rather than the wife deciding to lose weight as a result of the ultimatum, it is more likely that she'd kick the guy out because he's an insensitive jerk, THEN lose the weight for some other guy. And in the divorce, how likely would she be to agree to a favorable custody arrangement for the kids? I don't disagree that it is an important issue. It is, but giving an ultimatum like that to someone you supposedly love is just wrong. There's a difference between leaving someone because they beat you and endanger your life and leaving someone because they are not sexually attractive to you anymore and you're not getting enough sex. If you can't see that, then you've got a much bigger problem than a fat wife.

    This is an extremely one sided, fat woman sided, point of view.

    A woman who divorces for the reasons you’re recommending shouldn’t get custody. Her being a fat sow doesn’t make her a good role model for her kids to be with every day either.

    btw so far, reading down this thread I haven't seen a single person, man or woman, who agrees with you or is sympathetic towards your point of view on this.

  89. A lot of gentile, loving but determined discussion about her weight should proceed any ultimatum by many months. I think it would also be helpful for the man to resume having sex with his wife at least some if he’s stopped – while continuing to talk to her about losing weight.

    I’d ease into the ultimatum too. I’d talk about having to make one at some point before making one. I’d repeat that a few times.

    Also the ultimatum I’d make especially if there are kids is not to divorce her. I’d want that to be a sacred vow between us that we wouldn’t do so long as there are minor kids at home, especially. Instead I’d say that to avoid divorce, at some point I’m gonna have to talk to you about it being permissible for me to have a just or mostly just sex affair until you can lose weight and be fully physically attractive to me again.

  90. Wanderer says:

    You'd better advise men to move into the guest room or leave themselves so that they don't get themselves in trouble.

    This is, in fact, what several commentators above have advised men to make preparations for; specifically Anonymous' very good advice above at 2:25 AM. As much as the legal deck is stacked against men, there are still ways in which we can defend ourselves against women like you.

  91. Anonymous says:

    @ doug

    "I’m gonna have to talk to you about it being permissible for me to have a just or mostly just sex affair until you can lose weight and be fully physically attractive to me again. "

    Would she also be able to have an affair in this scenario? Because even a fat woman will have an easier time finding a sex buddy than a man, no matter his appearance.

  92. Anonymous says:

    "Egalitarianism and equal partnerships sound great in unicorn land, but they don't exist in the real world"

    Yes they do; it's called preferring your spouse over yourself. But, I agree with something called division of labor/spheres.

    I'll say this: unconditional love should, and often must, exist for a healthy marriage. But unconditional attraction? That's a different animal..

    Jennifer

  93. Anonymous says:

    Definitely one of my least favorite posts, advising threats and very much conditional love; being overweight is not abusive. Shows very much a secular and shallow view; no, fatness is not healthy or attracting, but threatening to leave because your spouse is unattractive is a very ugly thing to do. Nor is it the same as hitting someone; this is taking "game" and "your rights" way too far. Deep down, everyone wants and needs unconditional love, and many of the ideas here are disgusting.

  94. Anonymous says:

    I do think it's disgusting to cut your husband off from sex, and if she pulls that, there's nothing wrong with telling her the marriage isn't working, nor is there anything wrong with letting her know weight's not good. But threatening to leave because you can't love her if she's fat? That's horrible too.

  95. Anonymous—

    Would she also be able to have an affair in this scenario? Because even a fat woman will have an easier time finding a sex buddy than a man, no matter his appearance.

    No. He’s not that one that’s blown up like a sea lion so that she’s completely unattractive to him sexually.

    Bear in mind that this temporary (if she loses the necessary weight) above board infidelity is the alternative to his divorcing her. It's better for the kids.

    As well her having permission to have sex outside of marriage will tend to lower her incentives to lose weight and become sexually attractive to him again. If she makes substantial progress though he should probably stop having outside sex, and at least resume sometimes having sex with her, as an incentive.

    While even a seriously overweight woman can no doubt find SOMEONE who wants sex with her on some terms, it's likely to be tawdry drunken one offs that aren't gonna do her or his reputation or self esteem any good.

    Finally I firmly believe that a man having just or almost just sex with another woman is fundamentally less risky to his feelings of bondedness to his wife, than if the wife does it, at least if the man has experience with other women and some alpha traits. Women are monogamous or serially monogamous, men are polygamous or promiscuous in nature.

  96. Looking Glass says:

    Hehe, yeah, Athol really hit a cord that a lot of people don't really want to look at. And I do love how everyone is missing the point.

    He's doing the SMV stuff, but he hasn't enforced the "Captain/First Officer" stuff. That's really the problem. She doesn't respect him, inside the Marriage. As a result, she isn't doing what works for him, inside the Marriage, while he's doing what works for her, inside the Marriage. That's the key issue. It just comes to a "head" with regard to her weight and sex. That's just the focal point, it really don't have as much to do with her weight.

    Think of it this way: she badly damaged his visual attraction to her, which was limiting his emotional attraction to her. He attempted to correct this issue and *she* chose to kill all attraction to her by denying sex (which is an emotional rejection to men). *She* chose this path, so *she* has to deal with the consequences.

    And, to the woman that said she'd never be kicked out of "her" house: if the Husband was doing the Captain properly, then he could do it to you or any woman. That's the thing you're really missing with Athol's work.

    Also, while the Family Court system is unconstitutionally sexist in this country, it doesn't get rid of the "first strike" aspect. Whoever files first has a *huge* advantage. If he's setup enough for the Divorce, he's in good shape to actually keep the kids. Don't underestimate what "springing" a divorce on someone can do.

  97. Anonymous says:

    @ looking glass
    A woman being first officer and her husband being captain doesn't make her stupid. Unless she is unintelligent he won't be able to kick her out of the house or steal her kids. The Captain first Officer thing works because she wants it to. If she didn't then it wouldn't. Most women will push you all the way back if you try to force her from her home.

    I've worked in the family courts, and I assure you that unless she doesn't bother to fight for her kids he probably won't get them. At least in my state.

  98. Anonymous says:

    @ Doug

    If the husband has a right to sex with someone that he finds attractive then so does she. He doesn't want sex with her so she's free to look elsewhere. She'll probably find someone a lot more easily than he will. As a fat woman she may have a harder time finding a decent man to marry, but she can probably get an attractive, regular sex partner for the short term if she wants one. There's always black men, a lot of them seem to love fat white women.

    Anyway, I doubt that the woman would agree to that even for the kids. She'd more than likely wait until he had an affair, collect evidence of the affair and run off to divorce court to keep her kids and most of his income. Then she'd lose weight (because being single is a great weight loss motivator) and her next guy would get to enjoy the benefits.

    The husband will have to pick better next time, because he is basically screwed this time around.

  99. Anonymous says:

    Looking Glass, you actually have missed a lot of points. Athol's work also clearly explains that his methods work for either spouse.

  100. Stephenie Rowling says:

    "and her next guy would get to enjoy the benefits."

    And then she will get fat again when she "secures a man" is that better than losing weight and keeping first hubby and kids? Or she rather punish him for daring to tell her the truth? Really is that bad to tell the truth to people nowadays?

  101. Anonymous says:

    Depends on how it's presented, Stephanie. But to say that the wife overreacted here would be an understatement, wouldn't it?

  102. Women love this site when it's all about them. How to keep them attracted, how to ravish them all the time, etc. It's fun, fun, fun!

    Then Athol tells them that some of them are not worth attracting or ravishing in their current, fat state.

    The howls!!!

  103. Stephenie Rowling says:

    "But to say that the wife overreacted here would be an understatement, wouldn't it?"

    One year with no sex? That was not an overreaction, that was a power game. You cannot convince me that she spent 365 days in blinding rage and never actually took a look at the mirror and say to herself "wow he might have a point" Really she getting mad for a day, a week heck I will give her 1 whole month, okay? A year? A whole freaking year??!!! No way!
    She was using the power of her wedding ring to punish him because she loves her twinkies more than him.

  104. Anonymous says:

    LOL Yes, but it is possible she kept up the power trip so long because she convinced herself to stay resentful of him. Plus, she may have gone to some girlfriends who said, "Why that jerk! He's just wrong, honey; you stay just how you are and don't be giving him anymore sex until he apologizes and says you're beautiful".

  105. The Private Man says:

    "Plus, she may have gone to some girlfriends who said, 'Why that jerk! He's just wrong, honey; you stay just how you are and don't be giving him anymore sex until he apologizes and says you're beautiful'."

    Toxic female friends…

    No further comment necessary.

  106. Anonymous says:

    Raise your hand if you want to have sex with someone who thinks that you are disgusting looking. Most women don't want sex with someone who says "you aren't atrractive." That's why no sex for him. It is probably more about her feeling bad about herself instead of angry at him. If she is really so unattractive then why is he trying to have sex with her anyway? He is basically saying " you are ugly, but I am horny so let me use you instead of lotion and my hand." That's pretty easy to turn down and asking for that would piss off most women.

  107. Anonymous 12:13am–

    You are what's wrong with American women, and I'd never want anything to do with you.

  108. Anonymous says:

    @ Doug

    You don't sound like much of a prize yourself, so I'm sure that American women aren't mourning your loss. I suggest that you date whatever woman will tolerate you, because there probably aren't many.

  109. Wanderer says:

    @12:03 PM

    You'd be surprised.

  110. Anonymous says:

    My wife isn't fat but I thought it should be noted that following the MAP isn't going to be a piece of cake to do. Princesses often react violently to being put in their place. Mine did. We just had a little dustup on the 4th. She got really pissed when I told her what my place was and, as an extension, what her place was in no uncertain terms. Then after the temper tantrum and righteous indignation, she realized that she was turned on and I was laid like tile (at 4:30 am no less). I decided to give it to her a little rough just to punctuate who is boss really is around here. Athol's stuff works.

  111. Anonymous says:

    "I decided to give it to her a little rough just to punctuate who is boss really is around here"

    BWA-hahaha.

    Jennifer

  112. Athol Kay says:

    Women love this site when it's all about them. How to keep them attracted, how to ravish them all the time, etc. It's fun, fun, fun!

    Then Athol tells them that some of them are not worth attracting or ravishing in their current, fat state.

    The howls!!!

    I expectted more of a howling to be honest. :-)

  113. I certainly don't advocate hurling insults or giving the stinkeye to fat people; but this whole "fat acceptance" thing is not doing us any good. The obesity rate in this country is off the charts and it's just sad.

    If you wouldn't put up with alcohol or drug abuse in a spouse, why should you put up with food abuse?

  114. Anonymous says:

    Because it's not illegal or dangerous? I certainly think it should be brought up, but sheesh, it's not going to cause law breakage or car crashes.

    Jennifer

  115. Anonymous says:

    No, but many times it causes heart disease and early death at the worst and at the least it causes your spouse to be possibly not attracted to you.

  116. Anonymous says:

    what do u do when the husband is fat/physically lazy/

    He is a good breadwinner, affectionate husband.

    But prefers movies, junk food, instead of healthy food and biking outside with me.

    and his sex drive is low compared to mine because of the fatness.

    we dont have children yet, and I am afraid to because I feel he will not play with them or teach them sports

  117. Anonymous says:

    Ok, I couldn't read all of these comments. I got down to about the 8th one and just had to comment myself.

    I'm a woman. I was heavy (and lost weight). I like masculine men. I am spportive of this blog and I've bought Athol's book.

    But lets get some persepective here — weight loss is NOT easy. Let me be clear — I am NOT of the "fat acceptance movement" stripe. But, having lost weight myself and realizing how much BS is out there in regards to how to do it, it's NOT easy. One commenter said to get his wife Cooking Light subscription. See, THAT'S easy. But weight loss is far more than that. I've tried cutting calories and exercising like an idiot. Weight loss? When I was younger, yes. Years later? Nope. And lets address the fact that I gained and lost several time. Why was it so easy to gain?

    Food (pun intended) for thought: men have a (relatively) easy time losing weight UNTIL they become obese. Hmmm…. ever notice that obese men are feminized? Why? Fat is estrogenic. Once a man becomes obese, weight loss gets significantly harded. Much like a woman.This isn't an excuse for women, merely a fact that needs to be pointed out. In all liklihood, all of (us) women KNOW that we need to lose weight (trust me, we're surrounded by ubgodly thin women images ALL the time. WE KNOW!!!) But we try what we've been told and guess what — IT DOESN'T WORK!! Sure, it works for our boyfriends and husbands. Not for us.

    So… Where does that leave us ladies? Notice that I said "we try what we've been told…" Hint: do the opposite of what we've been told. CAse in point — the only lasting success for weight loss is Paleo. Ever hear of it? Well, I believe that it was US News and World Report ranked it DEAD LAST for diets. I think that Weight watchers was 1st (or close to 1st). Ever meet any woman on Weight watchers? I have. They're fat. They lose, then gain, then go to meetings and bitch.

    So my point is that weight loss is something that she should do — you, as the partner def deserve to be attracted to your mate. But trust me, in most cases she KNOWS this and WANTS to lose weight. HELP HER. Be supportive. Push her too much ("this is easy. Just stop eating") and she could develop an eating disorder. And that will def make her Numero Uno bitch. Nutrition plays a HUGE role in mental function. Eat right, eat whole unprocessed foods and watch as you BOTH become rational, smart human beings.

  118. Anonymous says:

    Kat is only howling because she herself is fat, judging from the pictures on her blog. That is also the reason she writes a blog where she brags about getting pumped and dumped by Ashley Madison losers.

  119. PT Barnum says:

    Oh for God's sake, let the woman set the frame.

    The issues isn't whether he loves her, the issue is whether she loves HIM.

    "Do you love me? Do you want to make me happy?"

    "I want you to lose weight. What, you don't care if I'm happy?"

    And so on. That's a nice escalation instead of an ultimatum.

    The ultimatum stage is "You either love me or you don't."

    Yes, it's passive-aggressive to a point. But it is a very, very clear passive-aggressive that makes it very difficult for her to ramble about how "impossible" you are.

    Really, is she supposed to say it's IMPOSSIBLE for her to lose weight?

    Or maybe that "well I really don't love you".

    You know, don't rule out a medical condition, though that is the only valid excuse.

  120. Anonymous says:

    "The issues isn't whether he loves her, the issue is whether she loves HIM"

    Nnope, sorry, that's too simple. The one setting their own conditions on the other, for the other to receive love, is the one showing that some love is lacking.

  121. Anonymous says:

    "So if she's not sexy, he's going to be sad. A wife doing what she can to make herself sexy is doing what she can to make her husband happy.

    Can't have that, now can we"

    All true, but you're forgetting something: love is about more than sex. If something's hurting their sex life that she can fix, she should, but that doesn't mean he gets to treat her like crap, make the marriage all about him and threaten to leave her if she doesn't submit to his demands.

  122. Anonymous says:

    "Here is how I got my husband to lose 40 pounds. I flirted with him, complimented him on his appearance and other things, and made love to him frequently and enthusiastically. I cooked healthier meals and asked him to take a walk or a bike ride with me afterward. I asked him to workout with me at the gym and told him that watching him lift weights made me wet. I asked him to wash my back in the shower after we got home from the gym and gave him a bj while we were in there. Now he loves working out like I love shoe shopping. We are both in great shape and I didn't have to torpedo his self esteem or my marriage to get here. This takes more effort then just saying "lose weight or I'll leave you" but it is also a lot more loving, and probably more effective.

    I hope that if I had come at him with some BS ultimatum that he would have had sense enough to drop me for someone who understands that marriage doesn't work that way"

    Amen! You're a smart lady.

    The guy here did need to step up and be more assertive; this wife was a whip-wielder.

    "never listen to anything a woman says about what she's attracted to."

    BS.

    "As well when 911 is called the man is hurt by that process vastly more than the great majority of VAWA “victims” were"

    Unbelievable.

    Jennifer 6

  123. Robertson says:

    Athol, do you have any thoughts for when it's not such an issue that the ultimatum is to even be considered, but when you notice that the pounds are starting to add up. A couple of years ago, before I even discovered this blog, I lost 40 pounds and became much more fit. Now I am increasing that with more working out. Still, even though my wife has even said on occasion, "wow, I need to keep up with you," and is not happy about the few extra pounds she's gained, she's very erratic about working out. I don't know how to help her achieve a more regular schedule. Any thoughts?

  124. Athol Kay says:

    Robertson – Jennifer and I do the Supreme 90 Day system together. That's the best I can think of.

  125. Anonymous says:

    I married my husband fourteen years ago. He had a gut that kinda shocked me, never having been with a man with a beer belly before. Now my husband's gut is HUGE and hangs over oddly. He is a good person basically…good provider, etc.. I love him. Other than concern for his health, I am not turned off by him. After reading this blog and the comments, it appears that I am being abused by his fatness, that he is trying to control me and purposefully trying to turn me off. He says he loves my cooking and just has to have that third helping, but I now know it is just him wanting to be fat so he can make me nausous in bed. He didn't have any body hair on his torso when I married him. Now he looks like a bear skin rug. Huh! Another of his plots to mock me. I will file tomorrow.

  126. StrangerThanFiction says:

    Prepare to hate me but I am fit female of 40 who is not on the fat acceptance band wagon when it comes to sex. Sorry, I'm just not into f'n a guy I've watched pack on a set of DD's and a blow out mid section that looks like the result of delivering multiple births.
    Newsflash! It's not just men who are visually stimulated. I am very much aroused by watching my man in action on and off the field. I used to get aroused watching my man doing mundane things – watching a fit man mowing the lawn can be foreplay. That is if he is in shape. I don't require six pack abs but an absence of gelantenous flesh and man tits is required to get the river flowing. When a 40 year old man begins to resemble your great aunt naked, trust me, you don't want to have sex.
    As for a double standard, I've maintained myself in this marriage. If I had sabbotaged myself by becoming grossly overweight/obese he would be outraged. He has openly confessed to his lack of libido when it comes to fat women as if he lives in a world devoid of reflective surfaces. So, if you are the fat husband complaining about sex, understand that you may be a real turn off to the uninspired woman You are complaining about. Just sayin'… I can certainly empathize with the fit SO's out there who have emotional investments in relationships with partners who care little about their own health & appearance, and even less about their partners happiness.

  127. Hardertosayno says:

    Thanks Stranger. The only thing worse than no sex is bad sex. Sex is better when both partners are fit and healthy regardless of age. Awareness of this changes everything because you cannot simply accept a sensual death because your partner decided they would rather gorge than have great sex.

  128. You are one sick and twisted guy. If you really think this is how love should be handled then you are so sadly wrong. First and overweight wife is nothing in comparrison to an abusive husband. If you fell in love with your wife solely for her looks then you are shallow. She is not a trophy to bring to work functions and to make you look good among your friends. She is a person with personality. Weight does not change that personality (unless of course the wife is feeling depressed). You offer your wife help when she seeks it and in a non-threatening way. I have been with my husband for 20 yrs. Teenagers when we met. I was teeny tiny. We had kids and i put on a lot of weight. I mean a lot of weight. But my hhusband didnt tolerate me he LOVED me UNCONDITIONALLY> I was still his wife who treated him with respect. Laughed with him and played with him. Cared for his kids and took care of our hoouse. We were still very social even though I weighed now almost 300lbs. When I was able to, when I chose to focus (when the kids were in dependant enough) I lost over 150lbs. I am now the physical wife he married but I was always the same emotional wife he married. I carried that heavy weight (up and down a wee bit) for 15 yrs of our marriage. My husband is a MAN… a real MAN.

  129. Isn't sloth and greed, two of the seven deadly sins, not to mention pride?
    When did we decide that becoming fat and lazy was a marriage option?
    Are people really debating this? Thank God I will never get married, can you imagine, being stuck in a marriage where someone holds a grudge for a year because their spouse doesn't want them to be unhealthy? American women have eating disorders not because the food is bad, it's because they are children and refuse to take responsibility by making healthy choices. There are a lot of starving children out there, why do we have to spend any more time on these mentally immature fat people with their self imposed health problems? Grow up people.

  130. Conveniently enough for Carol and I, we have a conditional love marriage so none of this is news to us. For both of us, we see ourselves as competing on a daily basis to win our mate’s affections. The fact that we’ve been married for 15 years doesn’t change that. I’ve already “won” Carol, but she is “Mine to lose” if I get fat, dumb and happy.

    For me personally, I’m much more comfortable relying on my own demonstrated track record of success than I am some nebulous “unconditional love” thing. When I’m not measuring up in Carol’s eyes, that a time to get busy, not get defensive. Because I DO get busy, I don’t need to worry about the conditional part.

  131. udolipixie says:

    I agree that love isn’t unconditional and that relationships have condition. For me a guy would be dumped and left if he got fat, lost his hair, lost his job, or I was unable to have orgasm inducing vaginal intercourse.

  132. ”Anyone screaming for unconditional love, knows they don’t meet the conditions. And yes, damn straight marriage has conditions. ” GOOD ONE!!
    I think it’s so irresponsible and unfair to the husband for a women to let herself go… I can’t believe how some people can be so inconsiderate.. Unless they have a medical condition that they can’t correct they have no right to subject the man to such distress and a pleasure-less life.
    I have this case in my mind.. he is a 9+ (inside and out) and she is a 5 – his distress is so obvious .. but he is too decent to hurt her feelings or have their relationship impact their children’s lives so he puts up with it..
    Well, it probably doesn’t help that I am a little attracted to him – but he deserves sooo much more.. it just makes my blood boil!
    Maybe I should offer to relieve him???? :))) Not! :D

  133. I struggled with this issue with my wife for quite some time. Unfortunately, I was never able to convince/help… her with her weight problem. It did affect our marriage, although overall we were a happy couple.

    She passed away last month at 55. Her weight and lack of exercise was certainly a contributing factor in her death.

    I’m so sorry to hear that. Hang in there.

  134. Just speaking from experience. I’m currently going through this with my bf. Every day I try to lose weight. I want to be fit and healthy. I’ve never been thin, and this has been a life long battle. Every time my bf touches me.. I wonder if he likes it. I don’t like wearing short things or showing my body around him. When we’re in public around women I know he finds more attractive then me, I want to hide and I feel ashamed–I feel ashamed that I hold hands with someone that doesn’t accept my body, and I feel like a fool trying to touch him or turn him on. How could I turn him on? Don’t be ridiculous. And as I lose more weight and get in better shape, I keep wondering if it’ll finally be enough for him. His eyes are the decider of whether or not the relationship will work. It’s torture.

    Maybe it’s better to leave him and discover my own happiness, and my own equilibrium, and find someone who likes me as I am–because even if I enter a relationship with the condition that I need to stay this way, it’s better than continually feeling tested.

    I’m probably speaking more for people entering a relationship unhappy versus becoming unhappy as one lets themselves go, but I imagine it feels the same.

  135. Do you wonder why wives get fat?
    1. Husband works too much by saying we need the money, but spends it on himself and not on wife.
    2. Husband comes home from work and gets right on the computer, never stopping to hug wife when he
    comes home from work-wife ignored again.
    3. Wife cooks all the meals, cleans home, takes out trash, cuts the lawn, just waiting for a ‘thank you’ that
    never comes…
    4. When was the last time we went on a vacation…can’t remember, still waiting.
    5. Worked hard to create my own business because husband says we needed money-tore my shoulder, operation completed, husband never offered to help me due to arm in sling…go figure!
    6. Need anymore reasons…I have a million of them!
    7. My last request to you all…at least tell your spouse you love them, I’m STILL waiting for my husband to
    mention it. Oh well, life hurts.

  136. As a woman, I agree with this post more than I disagree. Most marriages do come with “conditions” and I don’t think there is anything wrong with one spouse expecting that other to remain reasonably attractive, as long as they are abiding by the same rules. The tricky part is to figure out whether you’ve married a real #$%hole or not. Here’s the Reader’s Digest version of my story:

    I married a shallow man the first time around, who quickly revealed his true colors. Yes, I know, I take responsibility. I didn’t quite know how shallow he was, since while we were dating, I was always fit and trim, and if I may be immodest for a moment, considered beautiful and very sexually appealing by other men.

    The problem came within a year after we got married. My beloved father died suddenly and I was very bereft and slipped into a bit of a depression. I started to put on weight. My normal “fighting” weight for years (and while we were dating) had been around a size 6 / 8, and I’m a little over 5′ 8″ tall. The weight/body I had was always flattering on me, nice curve ratio. I had no complaints. I exercised, and kept my appearance up (make up, nice hair, nails, dressed well.) Soon after my father died, I started to stress eat. I went up from a size 6 /8 to about a 10 /12, all in all about 20 lbs. (Still groomed myself well, was never, ever sloppy.) Who would have thought that would have been such a deal-breaker? My ex started to withdraw and stopped having sex with me. As a matter of fact, he withheld all affection, yep, no kisses for me … I was a bad girl, I gained weight. Ashamedly, I started to “beg” for affection. Zilch. No smiles, no nice tones to his voice. I had to be punished. One day, he comes home, sees me crying in the kitchen after a particularly sad day (remember, this was only a few months after my Dad died, I was still grieving), sneers at me, looks me up and down and says (in the midst of my tears and with the look of a dead-eyed shark) “Hey, how much more weight are you going to gain here?” (True.)

    You know those thunderbolt moments you have in life, when a truth strikes you like a hot flash of lightening? You got it, I had one faster than a NY minute. I immediately knew I had to ditch this ice-man. I’m not saying any man is “wrong” for wanting a thinner spouse, but I was a far cry from obese. I immediately thought … hmm, if you stay with this guy you’d better pray you never get breast cancer or have any other tragic circumstance hit your life because this guy will bolt like a horse out of the gate, and you’ll be left drowning and your own without an ounce of support. And shouldn’t a mutually-loving marriage include support, “in sickness and in health”?

    Well, you can probably figure out the rest of my story: I dropped him faster than a hot potato. I did feel a normal “sadness” for a time, and yes it was hard emotionally, can’t lie and say I didn’t feel anything. Once I was free of him, I properly grieved for my father and really regained my self-confidence and self-love. I went back to running a few times a week, concentrated more on my eating habits and before I knew it, whoosh … I was back to my size 6 and looking fabulous. Life was infinitely better. And so was my sex life.

    So my thoughts are this: A spouse SHOULD be concerned about a healthy sex life and SHOULD want to stay attractive to their mate. Ultimatums, such as “tough, I’ll stay fat and there’s nothing you can do about it” are passive/aggressive tactics by a woman (or man) within a marriage. If you can’t deal with that type of bullying, think seriously about leaving for a better life. One of the best analogies above is what is a man, who as the breadwinner, decides to quit his job and become an unemployed drunk… You can bet that fat wife would be screaming “foul” at the top of her lungs and making his life miserable.

    There is a delicate balance here and parameters for “reasonable” thinking. If you marry and gain, say, 50-100lb after you say “I DO” just because you can or because you feel like it, chances are you’ll have a problem (assuming your spouse doesn’t join you on the weight gain wagon) and find yourself on the receiving end of no sex life or a drastically reduced one. If you gain, say, 15-25 lbs due to stress, just giving birth, or any other temporary life situation and your spouse immediately starts to give you hell and withholds sex, hmm… chances are you have a bigger problem than your creeping weight, you’re married to a callous idiot.

  137. Stratis from Athens says:

    My wife is fat and I love her so much. Sex is great with her.
    My problem is that she wants to be on diet and to loose weight. She is right because there is a danger for her health.
    however I’ll not be interested sexually for her if she will loose weight.

  138. Unconditional love is as real as pink unicorns. Girls love both.
    As with anything in life, a man with a ballooning wife has the freedom to choose. I chose to divorce. It’s my choice, and I can defend it to anyone who wants to argue that it’s the “wrong’ choice. Who he hell are you to judge!

    A man who wants to stay with his fat wife chooses to do so just as man who doesn’t. Kids of course complicate the situation, but it’s still a choice — just as it’s a choice for the woman to remain fat.

    An ultimatum is fine if that is what the man chooses as his last attempt to get his wife’s attention that this is a marriage destroying situation. If the wife chooses to defend herself for whatever reasons (justified or not), that’s her decision. If she has NO JUSTIFICATION for her fatness, then she’ll use the unconditional-love-defense to make the husband the problem, not her weight.

    This type of behavior is typical of American women who, with the help of the vapid mainstream media, have a ready-made justification for any behavior or defect of character. To their own destruction, women mostly justify and rationalize an unsupportable view by blaming MAN — in this case, the husband, for violating some mythical principal of the marriage relationship.

    “For better or worse…” Realy? Ok, let’s turn the table and say your husband puts on 50 extra pounds, stops practicing good hygiene, abuses the kids, and loses job because of his excessive drinking. What wife would keep her mouth shut about even one of these issues because of the principle of UNCONDITIONAL LOVE.

    Gimme a brea

  139. This is harsh, but I think I’m going to do it. I am not married yet and there are no kids involved. (BTW I was married before, I got custody so times are changing). I’m an 8 and my 2-1/2 yr girlfriend would be an 8 too if she were at least “medium build” but she is a 3 now (5’4″ & 260+ lbs). She has gotten SUPER pissed the two times in our relationship I even mentioned weight, but it is an issue. I am not attracted to her any more. I can either be “mean” and give her the ultimatum (sp?) or be “kind” and just dump her. For the overweight women reading this…. which method would you prefer? I have been 105% faithful to her but we’ve only had sex 3-4 times in the last year because I’m not interested. The only time we have had sex is when I’ve been out by myself, get turned on by another woman hitting on me and then come home drunk enough to have sex with her. I love this woman more than I love life itself (seriously) and my #1 goal in life it to re-marry and have more children. I don’t have many more years where a woman of child-bearing age will be attracted to me (I’m 48)… guess I could adopt or find a woman who already has children who want a father. I just feel like I’m wasting my last couple of good years on a woman I’m not attracted to. I’ve often said, “they all get old & ugly so might as well find a nice one” but I would like a little more time with an attractive woman.

  140. Antoinette says:

    Or your wife can tell you to suck her dick and go find that attractive woman you want and see if she wants you after I take your ass to the cleaners for child support and alimony and poison your children to know that you are a shallow bastard and you essentially bailed on them because it was important to you to be in a state of arousal all the time more than being with them. Because that is what I would say to my husband after that little speech you just made. So, um, yeah, not all women would just fall over and take that shit. I know I wouldn’t.

  141. I have been discussing this wife my wife for over a year now and the only response I get is shut the hell up or leave. She finally told me if I didn’t stop bugging her to workout( and I mean workout with me, I was already in the process of getting in shape myself and thought it would be good for the whole family) she was going to file for divorce. She has actually played this card to the point that she saw an attorney so I let it go. I took some advice from here about maybe curbing junk food in the house and the response from her was it is none of your damn business what I weigh and what I eat. She has gotten total control of our lives, I can’t say anything without it ending in her threating divorce or if I am not happy I know where the door is at and can feel free to leave anytime I want. I think she wants the marriage over and just doesn’t want to pull the trigger but instead is pushing everything in our lives that I can’t live with. Same as with sex, I am the only one who does the chasing in our relationship and that gets old, it nice to be wanted. Since over a year ago I have dropped over 25 pounds and have gotten increbly buff, but she could care less.

  142. What the heck are you thinking. A “4″ and “5″ an “8″. People are not numbers and you are totally superficial in this kind of asessment. Sure, a spouse may gain weight, or get a skin disorder, or lose a limb for that matter.
    All of these kinds of things make the physical appearance less, but a marriage is a commitment, before God, to love unconditionally. Yes, unconditionally. That is a problem with marriage today, people try to change the definition. If you do not wish to love unconditionally, then do not marry. Just “be” together and make it clear to your partner that your affection will wain if their appearance does, and that since you may still be an “8″ you will be off to find a higher number. That is not commitment. Marriage is about purification and sacrifice, which bring about spiritual growth and a taste for real happiness… that is the happiness of a big, giving, unconditionally loving heart. We all get old, ugly and weak. Only the heart can become a “10″ with time. YOur view on marriage is entirely materialistic and based in lust, not love.
    That is not marriage. Yes, a person should try to care fro their appearance, but sometimes we change and get ‘ugly’ in some ways and there are many reasons for it. It is not right for a spouse to think that attraction is based on the physical. That is the beginning on the relationship. Over time, the sexual lust should decrease and the path towards spiritual love and true romance blossoms in the heart. Fat or not fat, you spouse is your one and only. If you reduce them to a number, to be compared with others, then you are not truly married. You use the word marriage, but marriage is religious rite for spiritual growth. You are not interested in that, so do not marry.

  143. Thank you Sam!
    I fell in Love with a woman 25 years ago, we had two great kids that now are grown with kids of there own. For a brief time after our second child my wife lost her “mommy weight” and looked oh so good. I beamed with pride to be the lucky man to be in her company. The honeymoon was short lived and the weight packed on. She ate everything the kids still had on their plate as well as snacking on top of 3 square meals. I started to discuss (not demand) weight concerns. Walking was a chore because… kids were at home, knees hurt, not sunny enough, too sunny… Camping ended because of a melt down around friends. I did everything around the camp including keeping the kids busy and happy. She stayed by the fire miserable and full of complaints. Recently we bought an elliptical machine for her and I use it often. I’m 5’10″ 181 lbs, I don’t think I’m a handsome guy but she tells me I am. My wife tells me she uses the elliptical machine often too but everything is in the same spot I leave it in (it would have to be moved to use the machine). Truth is she reads a book instead. I don’t really know how much she weighs now but the next size up is a moo- moo (seriously). I know this because I actually clothes shop with her and encourage her to get things that will make her feel feminine and good about herself. I talk about walks still many years later and maybe taking a ball room dance class just to get her to want to exercise. In the last two or more years I have had a total loss of appetite for sex with her… I’m talking anorexic! Her hygiene is not to a desirable standard either. She is the same sweet woman I married in many other ways and I love her as I always have… I’m just not “in love with her”. The thought of having sex with a sportier model passes through my head (the head under my belt line). Then when the thought passes I realize I’d be giving up everything we have done together for so many years. I also still actually love her and leaving her would devastate her (she said so and broke down crying during one of our heart to heart discussions). Being height and weight proportionable would make her sexy to my eyes again. Having self pride and confidence would make her even sexier.

    “Don’t sweat the petty stuff… and don’t pet the sweaty stuff.” is how I think. 150-170 lbs would be petty, Making a line backer look skinny isn’t petty anymore.

  144. Malcolm Youdeley says:

    I could tell which of these posts was sent by Obese women.

  145. Jack Sprat says:

    A woman who is clean, well-groomed, sunny dispositioned, kind, considerate and respectful of others (despite carrying extra weight) is much more attractive to me than ones who are obsessed with appearance and bodily perfection.

    Our society has been conditioned by starved-down, surgery tweaked and enhanced (and airbrushed in photos) narcissistic celebs to want and believe we deserve perfection. What a waste of time that could be spent having fun. As, Joanne Woodward once observed, “Beauty fades and sexiness wears thin, but to have a man who can make you laugh everyday…ah, now that is a real treat!” My sentiments exactly about women. If a woman keeps herself well-groomed, makes the best of what she has, and is more concerned about enjoying life and having fun (both in and out of the bedroom) than with how many cellulite dimples are potentially plaguing her ass….I’ll choose her over a Paris Hilton any day.

    My wife is what might have been called pleasantly plump in years past, and some men today might consider her obese. Her butt jiggles and her thighs could be smaller. There is nothing petite about this woman. She is also one of the most delightful I have ever been around. Her laugh can change the atmosphere of a room. People are drawn to her. She is supportive and respectful of me and tolerant of my flaws. This is called grace…a concept totally alien to so many today. If she were skinny as a rail and flat chested (instead of having that great rack she sports), I’d love and desire her just as much….because of who she is and how she acts.

    Love and lust are two separate things…to not underdand the difference is a sad state that causes much misery for the uninformed. Love doesn’t always come perfectly gift-wrapped. The love we get is usually highly correlated to how much we give. Other people are not responsbile for our personal happiness. And, it would seem that when we accept ourselves as we are, it is so much easier to accept others as they are and not be all about changing people to suit our very possibly distorted ideals.

    Morbid obesity is a health problem and should be addressed as such, with concern, support, and encouragement and NOT ultimatums that carry with them the implication of disgust and a desire to control. Life has taught me that perfectionists are control freaks. People who are perfectionists and expect perfection from others are doomed to be malcontents. My advice to them? Get a life.

  146. When I married my wife 27 years ago, she weighed 170 pounds and looked really good. However for 27 years, she has steadily gained weight. She won’t tell me her current weight, but I overheard it at a doctor’s appointment – she weighs 370 pounds.

    I haven’t been sexually attracted to her in years, but that doesn’t matter anymore because sex became physically impossible about 3 years ago. I have tried everything I can think of to get her to lose weight without success. She has informed me that what she eats and what she weighs is none of my business. The fact is that food is more important to her than anything else, including our marriage.

    She had a heart attack two years ago and was clearly told by her doctors that she had to lose weight, but she still gains weight. She can’t walk right and can’t fit in an airline seat. She expects me to “love her unconditionally”.

    I doubt she will be alive 5 years from now.

    Gentlemen, when you are out choosing a wife, do not pick a woman who has had a history of significant problems with her weight (a general rule of thumb I would use is 30 or more pounds). These issues are likely to follow her throughout her life, and you do not want to be part of it. My wife had such a history – she lost 50 pounds before our wedding. I thought the problem was gone. I should have seen the warning signs and chosen someone else.

  147. MsWannaKnow says:

    Hi Mr. Athol Kay,

    I have a question for you. I struggled with weight since preschool exacerbated by severe hormonal/endocrine imbalance.
    I want to be enlightened. I know men need to have legitimate need for a reasonably attractive woman to marry. The hope is that she’ll stay that way and if she already is there’s a better chance. If not, sorry no ring for you.
    She is expected to remain reasonably attractive throughout childbearing and her adult life. By the time middle age hits and the spread begins he is so in love with her he is happy to grow fat and old together.

    I was an ugly kid, with a gorgeous slim mother. My father made no bones about telling me I needed to lose weight. They are supportive loving parents they took me to the doctor to sort out try and sort out the endocrine issues: I had facial hair, my skin was horrible, I was irritable and I remember during puberty when I felt desperately ugly and wanted to hide.
    One day my otherwise loving awesome Dad made a comment I cannot shake.

    That comment damn near cut my soul… I love them dearly and always aspired for a marriage like theirs. I know if I could get this endocrine issue under control and balance my weight and diet I could get down to an acceptable size it was a constant up and down yo you during adolescence.

    Dad said:
    ” I would never have married your mother if she looked like you do now” I love my Dad and I understand his intent was not malicious. But it struck a chord and let me feel that if I don’t meet the 5’5″ 115-145 lb threshold my life was over.

    Today I have lost weight after finding an exercise I truly love and my symptoms are vastly improving. I still see the ugly fat girl and I am confused by the “hey beautiful remarks” I catch myself holding down my head in a crowd. I am trying to better nagivate relationships and process the attention I am suddenly getting at 26 years old for the first time in my life. Especially because I know I am still overweight though significantly less so.

    Can a woman only hope to be chosen if she at an average slimmer weight then hope he’ll love the fatter her decades later? Why doesn’t it work in the reverse? Men need attraction first to want love the inside, is love sustainable if attraction fades at what point does it?

    I don’t know where I am on the scale, guys indicate interest but I don’t know how to process it, I am still chubby and I want to make sure the guy feels I am a genuinely good catch and I am not confident of that yet.

    In an ironic twist of fate exactly 10 years later after my Dad’s painful yet unintentionally so comment…my Mom now in her 50′ has blew up to a 12-14 (my size at 16 years old) and my Dad who has also gotten slightly chubby is still crazy about her. I hope I can finish losing those last 30 lbs and get down to the threshold or I am screwed.

    Hope you answer. thanks!

  148. same says again update says:

    Here is an update to my situation. She filed for divorce in feb left me and my 3 children until may when custody rotation of week to week began. The divorce was final over a week ago. The now ex-wife is still getting larger except for spending time with her kids she is now drinking, bar hoping, getting high, and started all this at the age of 36. My 3 children hate going back to her house at the end of my week. I don’t even know the person I once was married too. My point here is that weight or was it a self destructive personality that ruinef my martiage. Her weight was just one part of her life that she finally just said the hell with it I don’t care, and it was a foresite of character flaws to rear up over the next couple of months. I have met some one who used to actally kickbox and loves fitness as much as I do. The sex life is incredible my kids love her to pieces and family to and activities together are always a priority and s way of life now. I don’t hate the ex any more, I am very worried about her place and responsibilities with the kids, but I was able to go get what I wanted without cheating on her. I fought hard for shared custody of my kids and I don’t pay her support and she does pay me support. Good luck men, until someone wants to change for themselves they aren’t ever going to change for you.

  149. I know this thread is old… but I feel that I need to get expressive help from here…

    My wife and I have been married 10 years… It has been good, with ups and downs. Since meeting her, she has grown to unhealthy proportions and cannot even breath after climbing stairs. She is a good hearted person and can be one of the funniest people I know. She is also the laziest, largest and unhealthiest person I also know too.

    So… my belief is to split chores… she cooks, I clean the kitchen / dishes. I vacuum and she dust/mop. I take care of the yard and household and she does laundry. We have no children. Why? We both are early 40′s and I said to her 5 years ago… If you lose weight then we can have children (I expressed that I do not want to raise children as a single parent when she kills over sooner than later). “Fair enough”, she agreed… She got her masters degree recently which is great for her career.

    We have split bank accounts… I make most of the money and I pay for the house and all bills (except her car or credit card). She does the grocery shopping and I pay the bills. I do not know what she spends her money on all the time, but is usually fast food or junk food.

    Our lives have become sadly routine day in day out. She sleeps 80% of the week/weekend and watches tv, gets on internet or eats… Every week… same thing. Sadly, my habits have changed due to hers… I stay at home all the time, never go out… get on the computer / xbox in my free time (it is the only outlet I have). I tend to eat what she does… which is killing my healthy weight loss and I am gaining weight. She brings junk home to eat all the time… I just give in and eat but I exercise to counter it.

    I have talked to her about her weight … initially in the wrong way… “I am embarrassed to go out with you… You are getting too fat… etc.” I have changed my tone and changed it to “I am concerned about you and your health… You need help and the only person that can do that is you. I am not happy with your lack of concern for your health.” Her replies now are “You married me, you knew what you were getting into!”

    Ok, granted the weight issue is a big one but there are others… She doesn’t clean the house at all unless her parents or a very rare occasional friend comes over. I do the garbage… I clean when I can … I vacuum and sweep. I continually pick up crap as she leaves stuff all over the place like a 12 year old’s bedroom. Stuff will stay there until I move it or such… A cat bed that sat on the shelf for months (with cat vomit on it) in the laundry room… I was patient… after months and months.. I just grabbed it and threw it away… she doesn’t even know it was gone. First off… disgusting .. secondly… wth? Stuff is all over the house and I continually pick up all the time. I hate clutter and I married the Clutter Queen. I tend to be a neat freek but I have calmed it WAAAAY down over 10 years… but I have a limit where I cannot stand tripping over stuff.

    I am 42 and with no kids and question my life decisions now. She is a good person.. and refuses at all exercise at all… I encourage her but no go. Have a new treadmill downstairs in nice cool room in front of a tv… I am the only one to use it since buying it. Have videos… walking shoes… bikes.. whatever… she doesn’t want to sweat or even walk up and down our neighborhood hill. I have asked her to join me continually to just walk and she refuses. She has depression and so do I … but we are medicated but I believe hers is drastic seeing everything as a whole.

    So we have a destructive person here…

    Refuses to diet, eats massive amounts of food. Comfortable living in a dirty dusty house all the time. Usually unkempt in appearance and doesn’t care how people see her. Refuses to exercise or do anything outside that might involve losing calories (unless it is eating). Sleeps all the time…if not sleeping then watching tv or reading in bed.

    She wasn’t this way 10 years ago… she was chubby but not morbidly obese. She was mindful of cleaning and keeping things clean around the house unlike she is now. She is a great person other than that and very gifted with humor and a creative mind for teaching .

    Now comes the sex part… it has been completely degraded due to her weight. I am not attracted to her now in the least bit even though I have tried and tried. It is to the point where I do not want to even do the deed and cannot “finish” due to my disinterest. She is only doing it probably just because she knows I require a sexual response in the marriage. Granted… it is always the same thing… due to her weight. there is never foreplay due to her choice in the matter… therefore sex has become very undesired now.

    I have not cheated but get hit on occasional… granted I have a slight beer belly but working on it… eating decent, exercising… I am no GQ model.. but I care. I care about my health and the families future.

    We do get along well as relationship goes but I am to the point where I do my thing and she does hers… we only see each other now when eating (in front of the TV) or in bed or sometimes during the day. Our schedules differ now .. and so do our interests…

    Her parents are good people and are ultra religious and am sure this will come into play as a wild card if I say we want a divorce. My parents are gone and I get along with hers well (but they do not live with her). Funny that her dad said on the wedding day RIGHT after we got married “She is YOURS to deal with now, good luck with that!” I always thought it a joke… now days … I question that…

    Ugh…

    Been through a divorce… this is my second marriage… and her first one. No kids, either one of us. I personally know what a divorce is like… ugly and costly… emotionally and financially. I have the house in my name.. and recently incurred about $20k of bills for the damn place. We really don’t have much in savings (under $1k each) due to paying off these new house bills…

    Reasonably if I say we divorce… wtf will happen? I guess I pay for her apartment for some time until she gets on her feet and I continue with working on the house bills and stay there? Or she wants us to sell the place and pretty much all equity paid will go to the new house bills.. so we really gain nothing short of maybe $1k each and have to find a place to live?

    Being single at 40 scares me some… but I can manage… Hitting the dating scene at 40 and not being a fully fit prime physical condition as a GQ model reduces the opportunities. I also have sleep apnea and have to deal with that… as would some other woman in the future (when you have to sleep with a sleeping air hose every night).. this is tough thing for some women to accept I would think.

    She would get even more depressed and become suicidal or something crazy… she is that type of person.

    I don’t know what to do… we have talked before about marriage happiness, health, exercise, and lifestyle and she is the only one that can change herself if she even wants to (which is apparent she fine with who she is now).

    Throw in the additional factor that I am attracted to Asian women (have always been) and still am… she isn’t Asian and is southern Caucasian as they come (which I am starting to not like).

    Welcome to my fucked up life… it could be worse… it could be better… Worth the risk or worth the misery?

    ~Somekat

  150. same says here again says:

    Somekat, you are not wanting to here this but you are going to have to move on with your life, not necessarily without her at first, just start the change and see if she gets motivated to change her life. If you go back and read my two posts and the 2 year time frame it took place in you will see that I tried and after my divorce finally happened it came down to will and that was that my exwife wanted to live the way she wanted to live whether it was unhealthy or not. Since my most recent post she has put on another 35 pounds, she is getting bigger by the month and has no self respect, she is going to a Halloween party dressed as a playboy bunny, yeah, really. Mean while I am ripped and in the best shape of my life and I am trying to do the best I can to raise my kids and find a decent woman. I posted a meme on facebook from a gym page and it has a really hot woman and really hot man and the caption reads, “Women, if you don’t look like this, don’t expect us to look like that.” Divorce will suck, I was depressed and even became an alcoholic for a couple of months, but I straightened up and found that I would have just been miserable if I stayed married. The question is are you going to rip off the band aid eventually or are you going to pull and tug and drag it out and make it hurt forever. I am still single but have me women that were 100′s of times the woman my exwas in character, physical fitness, and I have went out with a couple of women that were a little overweight but I find that there is usually some other personality flaw that goes along with that to run me off. Don’t stay married because you are afraid of being alone, that is why I let my wife run over me for as long as she did and one reason I was not the one to leave, because I would have rather had been married to someone even if they weren’t everything I wanted, at least I had someone. I am learning to be the best I can and become the best man that I can be, be the best father I can be and then the right woman will come along. At the end of the day, it is your choice because you are the one who will have to live with your choices. I feel for you, you are in a spot and it sucks being where you are at. I hope everything will work out for you.

  151. Emotional Scars says:

    Emotional scars are no joke. I am not a vengeful person. When I decide and am ready to loose weight, I will loose the weight in my own way. I have to realize it for myself. Weight loss is a very personal, emotional and mental thing. Just because someone is “demanding” it must happen now, doesn’t mean you are ready for it. Doing it for someone, whether they are making demands or not – is just not going to work.

    Thing is about me (and I can’t speak for other women) is that this man (or any man) is no longer attractive to me. I don’t care if they are buff or flabby – I will look at them in disgust. It’s all mental and emotional. You could have said something 15 years ago, and I live with it like it was said yesterday. It hurts the same. There is no more sexual desire for a man that makes me feel like less of a person – period. If I loose weight, and he decides I’m good enough for him – he’s still not going to get any (definitely not out of spite – he’s just not attractive to me anymore – and not being attractive equals no sex) – and I think that’s ultimately the demise of the marriage.

  152. Mmmmmmm says:

    I have the opposite problem.

    When I married my wife she was a curvaceous, huge breasted, jiggly assed siren. She wasn’t rolls of fat fat. She was perfect. When she wore a tight party dress she was breathtaking.

    She started “dieting” to get skinnier (I didn’t ask her to do it). Now she’s skinny and beautiful in that way, but my boner isn’t as hard as it used to be.

    Seems the grass is always greener on the other side.

  153. I love my wife so much but have trouble telling her that i would be so much more into sex if she would shape up. She is thin on top but carries all her stress and weight in her butt and thighs. It seriously isn’t fun. I know I should tell her and she has said that that part of her body is her least favorite. I never know what to say when she says these things. I’m active and in shape. I run and watch my food. She doesn’t. I am frustrated as I spent all year last year in the gym and am very proud of what I have done. She uses excuses like their isn’t anything she can do about her cellulite. I often wonder if she really cares about turning me on because I buy her cute things to wear all the time and she never wears them. We have been arrived for six years. No kids. And I am so depressed because our sex life isn’t what I want it to be. She knows this and when I don’t speak up (Bc I never want to hurt her feelings) she gets bent out of shape because I’m so quiet. I really don’t want a divorce but she has never been enthusiastic about sex and I often feel like when we do, she is just throwing me a bone in order to keep me around. Agggghhhhh!!!! The op said a very private hell. No kidding. How many men go through this?

  154. Giving your wife a speech telling her to loss weight for you makes you sound like a selfish man. What you should said is ‘ Baby I want you to loss weight not for me but for yourself and your health. I’m willing to help you. If you don’t loss weight I’m leaving you because I’m not going to set around watching you live a very unhealth lifestyle.’ If you tell her all that she will see that you care and will be motivated to loss also she will be less likely to be very upset about it.

  155. My EX husband wanted me to be a frumpy whale so that no other man would look at me. He was angry when I lost weight and got into shape BUT he liked to ogle at young women with good bodies and comment about them – in front of me!

Speak Your Mind

*