Don’t Powerlevel Noobs Unless You Want To Be In A Crappy Guild

Perhaps my all time favorite comment on the blog…
Ian Ironwood has left a new comment on your post “Beta Orbiters Don’t Ever Understand “No” Unless It’s Cruelly Spoken
I got into someone’s orbit, once, back in the Blue Pill days. I did all sorts of things for her, treated her nicely, waited patiently while she ended a relationship, undertook a lot of responsibilities for her. And then, at a critical moment, I made my Move. She was shocked. She was offended. She rejected me good and hard, told me that we would only be friends at best, that “I wasn’t her type.” She was kind of brutal about it, as if the very idea of me dating “out of my class” was ludicrous.
So I walked away. I quit calling her. I found distraction. I quit answering her calls. I got angry with her, then objectified her, and I completely severed any ties with her. Since we had a common group of friends (we were undergraduates) the group ended up shattering when I quit attending functions, and our friends wanted to know why. She blamed me for getting mad, blamed me for upsetting the group and starting a fight with her friends, and blamed me that I wouldn’t “just be friends” and keep coming to her study group.
And you know what? I survived. Not only survived, it was the first real taste of “red pill” I’d ever had. I felt powerful, if wounded, and even though I was angry at her, I was able to turn it into something much more productive.
And do you know what else? Without my help she couldn’t complete two key papers she needed to graduate, she failed, and she flunked out of school. According to mutual friends she’s now divorced and hideously fat in Seattle, her life having taken some unfortunate turns since she failed out of college.
Was it her “fault” that I liked her and she didn’t like me back? Perhaps not. Nor was it mine. Was it her “fault” that she flirted with me in the first place to get my help in a class she was struggling with, knowing she wasn’t interested in me? Perhaps not. Nor was it mine. Was it my “fault” that I withheld assistance she was counting on to not fail out of a $40,000 a year private university, because I was embittered over her rejection? Perhaps not. I could have gone over at the eleventh hour, helped her out, gotten her through her crisis and got her to graduate, but honestly once she rejected me, I didn’t see that as a compelling course of action.
Several lessons were learned, among them: don’t flirt with a nerd unless you mean it, ladies.
Athol:  The beauty of this is it’s a revenge story, but Ian did nothing that was actually causing her suffering. He just ended his above and beyond assistance and let natural consequences take it’s course. He was under no obligation to run her through college at all. She wanted something for nothing and that’s an unfair trade.
He could have done her papers for her, but after she was done pumping him for them, she would have dumped him.
Now imagine if he’d run her ass through college and actually managed to marry her… talk about your bag of sand to drag through life. Anytime you find yourself in a World of Warcraft guild where the guildmaster’s wife or girlfriend is an underperforming healer, just quit the guild. Trust me on that one.


  1. JCclimber says:

    Uh, sounds like my first marriage. I think I did about 20% of her frickin' homework. Especially the crucial stuff. She left 8 days after getting her degree.

    My life has gotten infinitely better, and the red pill was bitter at first but became sweeter over time (many years ago).

  2. The lady could have hired a tutor to support her to get her homework done – when you pay $40K for a degree, you need to protect the investment!

    HOWEVER getting someone to do your stuff for you is not really an optimal solution – you need to learn how to learn. Most things are learnable – I've passed subjects through rote learning only and 30 years later realised what it all meant!

    You might start by asking successful students how they study and what resources they are using.

    Often teachers can provide advice – asking questions and discussing assignments is often more successful than just asking them to comment on a written work.

    If you are still not managing at school, talk to your parents – perhaps they can help or at least provide a budget for a tutor.

    and …OOO …. for those that are tempted to help out too much – provide the tools to do the work but don't do the task. Tough love is best in the end and will weed out those that are of poor character or no where near your intellectual equal. I think this would also be the 'alpha' strategy.

    Good luck with negotiating the extremely tricky task of being young!

    :-) Candice

  3. alphapersona says:

    ATHOL – "He could have done her papers for her, but after she was done pumping him for them, she would have dumped him."

    I find this to be an acceptable scenario.

    Some Ass > No Ass.

    I like his "Blue Pill" v "Red Pill" analogies, and I think I'm going to have to start saying that….

  4. Oh as long as we're talking about school and tutors, let me add my favorite piece of advice along those lines: USE THE OFFICE HOURS. Professors have office hours for a reason, and there is never a line except the day before a test. Get smart and use that time. It's cheaper than a tutor (free) and he's sitting there anyway and knows the material better. He will also become sympathetic to your cause if you demonstrate that you care. Such factors do matter, no matter what anyone says.

  5. Anonymous says:

    Funny, I'm a wife playing WoW. My husband and I are both quite good players that outperform our gear. He tells people that I'm a great healer, and people usually think "yeah right." Then one night last week I stepped in Firelands for the first time with 363 gear and outhealed every other healer, including more geared healers. It garnered me quite a few kudos from the raid members of the 25-man hardmode guild.

    Anyway, on topic. Carrying people makes the good people feel good, but nobody should expect to be carried. The guy in this story came out the real winner. Some guys in the manosphere say a girl's intelligence doesn't matter at all in the SMP. They're losing out, because truly smart nerdy girls keep in shape, cook and clean well and efficiently, happily play video games, and make great long-term mates for fellow nerdy guys.

  6. The Woman Formerly Known As Beautiful says:

    I was Homecoming Queen and yet I managed to marry a nerd. He gets hotter every year and the "hot" guys from my youth get less so. Food for thought Ladies.

  7. Anonymous says:

    This "pill" analogy is bothering me. It sounds like either way, someone is trying to shove THEIR ideas down our throat. I mean, how do we know that this girl "flirted" with him? I've have literally seen ALL of my male friends (and there are a bunch) think that just because a girl smiles at them, she likes them and is flirting with them. If someone wants to help me and I need help, why should I turn them down, esp if they're good at hiding that they want to get with me. Add to that the fact that this woman was not a woman, but a child, and do I need to go on? We're talking now with years of experience under our belts. In college? We didn't know jack.
    Sure, there is a strong chance that she did flirt with him. OR… there is an equally strong chance that she didn't and he was bitter and now (all these years!) is gloating. Which pill do you want to take? Personally, I'd rather not take any. I know the Matrix analogy, but this pill is getting closer and closer to Kool-aid for my liking.

  8. alphapersona says:

    Anonymous, you miss the point behind the pills. In the matrix, as in this story, the pills are alogorical to either knowing the truth or continuing to live the lie.

    All these years he was choosing to be deceived, but now that he's taken the "red pill" his eyes have been opened and he see's the truth for what it is: he has entered reality.

    How do we know the girl flirted with him? Chances are she did. I feel like you're either a woman who is angry (perhaps because she see's a bit too much truth in this other woman's behavior) or a beta who orbits a few girls and still holds out hope for one of them to realize how great he really is – Either way, the fact of the matter is, most college age children (you were right in calling her that) are manipulative. They're young, attractive, and guys fall all over them – why not use what the good Lord gave you to your advantage?

    Groups of college girls in my town go out with nothing but IDs because they know that men will buy them drinks if they're just a little bit flirty (I've even heard of some women making contests out if; eg who can drink the most for free?).

    The point in my post is this: Never underestimate the power that a good pair of tits has on the male mind. Men need sex like women need emotional connection. Just as some men have adapted to use a woman's emotional need to get sex, most young women understand that the key to a man's heart is through his penis. If they can flirt and hint that there is a future chance of coitus, they know that men will help them do most anything.

    No one is bitter about it, or resents it – we're all just standing on the other side, looking back at our selves and our experiences, and learning from our naivety.

    As much as you bash the "pill" example (by the way, how is someone forcing you to read this blog, I'm curious?), you still live in a dream world – expounding to the world the beauty of the wool pulled over your eyes.

    Hope that cleared things up.

  9. Anonymous says:

    My rule of power leveling is; I'll help you power level your toon if you help me power level mine. (b^^)b

  10. Athol…

    This isn't really related to this post at all, but thought this would be a good place to put it to maybe gets some varied commentary.

    What are your thoughts on guys that seem to enjoy being controlled by their wives?

    A friend and I were discussing it two night ago about a mutual friend. He basically has always dated girls and is married to a wife who he continually checks in with, asks permission etc…

    In fact, we were discussing the last time he and I were out. He was out with me, I was driving, apparently we were out too long as his wife drove out to pick him up.

    I would go ballistic if my wife tried to treat me like I was a child and she was my parent, but he seems to relish it.


  11. On the other hand, being an orbiter is good for omegas with high standards because it's the only way we can be around females we find attractive for long periods of (strictly platonic) time. It's better than nothing. Orbiting allows an omega to at least nibble of a few crumbs leftover by women far outside our SMV. The omega has to be careful, however, to *never* let his interest show. I've used this tactic to be around 4-5 hot women for years while fellow omegas gamed alone. The lighter side of this can be illustrated by the following story:

    The Prof, his Wife, the Omega, the Alpha & his Squeeze

    The Omega saw the movie 'The Cook, the Thief, His Wife & Her Lover' (hereafter, “The Cook”) in an art theatre over Christmas break in 1994 with a friend. He recommended the movie to his Sedimentary Petrology professor – the Prof – who the Omega was a teaching assistant for at the time – and the Prof went and saw it with his wife – the Wife – who stormed out enraged sometime during the film. The Prof refused to leave, as he loved the film, and had to take a cab home. Within six months, the Wife had left him.

    The Prof jokingly would thereafter tell the Omega that the Omega (and The Cook) had caused the breakup of the Prof's marriage, with a self-deprecating chuckle in his voice and cold steel in his eyes. However, the Prof was the inside track to a TA position for a colleague of his at Penn State, where the Omega hoped to get his PhD, but this never materialized. Did The Cook ruin the Omega's shot at going to Penn State?

    Well, the Omega still hung with an old (and really handsome) childhood friend – the Alpha – who was hooking up with one of the Ohio Budweiser Girls – the Squeeze – who was also a student at the Omega’s school (in pre med) and who the Prof lusted after. The Omega and the Squeeze were good platonic friends, the Squeeze enjoying having someone to talk to at school that wasn't female but who wasn't a slobbering horndog and who would studiously look her in the eye. The Omega liked the opportunity to slyly drink in the eye candy from the 50-yard line, far closer than any of the other salivating omegas and gammas could get, and the Alpha liked the idea that, since 9's don't cheat with 2's, he could leave the Squeeze with the Omega and thus safe from the attention of other guys. Like when the Squeeze took the Omega to see The Cook because the Alpha couldn't stand arthouse movies.

    But the Prof took notice of the Omega's insider status with the Squeeze. He and the Omega had a shouting match over this one day when the Omega went in to discuss the Penn State situation – more specifically, they rowed about the purported role of the Omega to help the Prof, still on the rebound from the Wife, to woo the Squeeze away from the Alpha in order to make amends for recommending The Cook.

    Let's just say that had the Omega never recommended The Cook to the Prof, nor been so loyal to the Alpha about the Squeeze, the Wife might never have left the Prof, while the Omega might be have been a Penn State alum instead of getting said PhD somewhere else. No good deed goes unpunished.

  12. Better to be a chump than a pimp.

  13. Athol Kay says:

    Add to that the fact that this woman was not a woman, but a child, and do I need to go on?

    A female college senior is a "child"?

  14. Everywhere I see people that are 40+ and still children. Call it a crappy superpower. ;)

    And I´m NOT talking about MMO gamers, though they have their fair share.

    BTW people, stop playing games where you HAVE to power level! :P
    Beautiful story, BTW.

  15. Anonymous says:

    Anonymous October 19, 2011 1:04 PM chiming back in again.

    To Alphapersona, please read my comment. I know somethings can get convoluted, so let me reiterate that I get the Pill analogy. My point was that it's *morphing* into a "drink the koolaid" mentality.

    Also, let's be nice — I am not angry. I come to this site cuz I really like guys and genuinely want to hear their opinion (not to mention how to be a better wife). But sometimes, I have to play devils advocate and show that there's usually another side to the story. I always listen (and mostly take) the mans side. If my tone was angry, that's not my intention. Also, in no way was I defending the woman. I was saying that *we don't know*. So everyone stay cool. We rush to the conclusion that someone else is a jerk. I just want to show that the situation is usually more complicated than that. If we're not careful, then it devolves into woman-hating. I've seen this against men in the fem-osphere (is that even a word? Eh…). And I def see it happening (against women, duh) in the manosphere. And sometimes, the comments here can get uncomfortably close to that.

    And to Athol's "just a child" comment. Yes. When I was in college (and I can attest that there are a good many females that feel this way too), I was just coming out of the gawky teenage years — braces off just mere months, boobs just starting to come out, etc. Until a guy grabbed me and shouted "I want to go out with you!", I had no clue that he liked me. I look at pictures of myself back then and I was beautiful! I now realize how many guys wanted to get in my pants. But at the time? Genuinely didn't know. Now? Now I totally get it. But now I'm 38. Now I read your site. Seriously, even up until a couple of months ago when I started reading this blog, I didn't have a clue. Yes, some guys my gut was telling me that they liked me. But now, with the power of your information, I know a bit more. There's a level of humility that a lot of women have — we either can't see or don't trust our instincts (that little voice that a lot of girls have that says "he couldn't possibly want you. You're too skinny and goofy…").

    So all I'm saying is that "pretty" girls fall into 2 camps — those that know that they're pretty (and use men accordingly) and those that don't. This woman may have been the one that uses men. Or maybe she isn't. Remember — all women don't read this site! Keep that in mind. Just like all men aren't jerks that use women for sex, all women aren't jerks that use men to get what they want.
    I also want to end with that these comments from me may in fact be a bit overkill for this particular blog post. This is just accumulation after reading comments from post after post and finally feeling that I need to chime in.

  16. Athol Kay says:

    The problem with learning about Fitness Tests is suddenly everything remotely difficult a woman does in relation to you is suddenly viewed as a Fitness Test. It takes some time to work out the kinks and learn what is and is not a Fitness Test.

  17. Hey! I would be a better healer if I got the kill things more often you know? I picked a Paladin for a reason. Is hard to see everyone pocking at werewolves and you just healing! *criesinacornerinfetalposition*

  18. Athol Kay says:

    Pally is different now. Can't do a Shockadin spec anymore… :-(

    I might play again after New Year, too much to do before then. Disc/Holy priest or Resto/Elemental Shaman.

    Nurse, MMSL or WoW. I can only do two of those at a time basically.

  19. Ian Ironwood says:

    Wow, I go on vacation for a while, and I get my own post! I'm honored!

    For the record, the girl not only flirted, she was "over the top" flirting with me to a) get my help in her classes and b) to try to inspire jealousy in another man. In my blue-pill haze I saw her as the victimized princess and wanted to White Knight her into Happily Ever Afterland. Once I tasted the red pill, I started to recognize the manipulation and genuinely felt sorry for the guy.

    Most women of her age at the time (early 20s) are just understanding the power that their bodies and their sexuality have over men. This particular chick was feeling on top of the world, because she was about to get rid of one dude she was tired of and use another to get her through her last semester, and (unknown to me at the time) she was trying to seduce one of my more Alpha housemates at the time as well, just to prove that she could.

    But since that ugly revelation about the depths to which some women will go to advance themselves over a pile of broken and battered nerd corpses, I've been far more careful to watch out for them. I'm already having to caution my 11 year old son (a nerd protege) about those girls who are already starting to flirt him out of his lunch money and homework assignments. It's rough, but after watching his 18 year old female cousin brazenly flirt with a retail manager to successfully get a job at the mall recently, I pointed out: "Behold the power of Boobs. Don't let that happen to you, son. Not unless she's worthy." Just what makes "her" worthy is a lesson for another day. In the meantime, I'm instilling a deep suspicion of any girl who overtly flirts with him, and making him question her motives. Hopefully, we can get through any residual Blue Pill BS before he gets into high school.

    Thanks for re-telling my story, Athol!

  20. Athol Kay says:

    Thank you Ian!

  21. Just joining the chorus here that Jen’s additions to the post were the best part. It was all Greek to me till she jumped in. I dont know about the noob thing. How do you determine who is a noob. I had to say, you know what, enough is enough to myself about someone this week. I still dont want them to rot in a fire though.

  22. Sorry wrong post!

  23. The comment was supposed to be for this post:

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