Sexy Move: Goofy And Groping

Reader Question:  Last night I told my wife to meet me in bed after we got our kid down for bed…she seemed into it.
So we get into bed and she says she’s exhausted but wanted to do other stuff which in my mind meant bj or hj, but she meant kissing and cuddling…augh.
I wasn’t in the mood for that so I kind of blew her off and said I wasn’t in the mood for that and went and watched TV.  She said we should be able to do other stuff besides sex…blah blah.
How should I handle that?
Athol: I have two thoughts here…
(1) She wanted to be warmed up and escalated before becoming agreeable to having sex. She was interested, but she went to bed lukewarm and you went to bed hot. Maybe kissing and cuddling is what gets her from lukewarm to hot. What happened was you broke off the seduction early. Neither one of you got what you wanted from it.
(2) She doesn’t get that “just kissing and cuddling” in bed is going to drive you crazy when you are horny.
Jennifer: I second this point. I didn’t understand this at first either. Then the “touch the penis make the penis happy” rule was firmly stated lol.
My suggestion is to increase the physical interaction outside the bedroom. If she’s been filled up on her cuddle and kiss need before bedtime, she’s either going to go to bed more interested in sex as opposed to cuddling, or go to bed actually sleepy.
This can also be coupled with an understanding that going to bed is either going to head toward having sex, or just going to sleep, and not that touchy-feely-snuggle-pawing-and-then-nothing-happens-FML-thing.  But to do that, you have to be meeting the physical affection needs outside of bedtime.
The trouble really starts when you go to bed excited and expecting to have sex, and then don’t get it. Even if you got a blowjob, you might have been upset because in your mind it was going to be a sixty minute session of sweating, soaking and sizzle.
But if you really are getting baited and switched by her, then what you did was the correct response. It’s not nice to be promised sex and had it dangled in front of you, and then whipped away at the last minute. In that case I’d just be pissed off and getting out of bed too. Internet porn night for the… well not exactly a win, but a draw at least.
Jennifer and I spend a lot of time incidentally touching, stroking, kissing, flirting and groping each other, with about 90% initiated by me, all the way through an evening. We probably have 12 points of physical contact throughout the evening as a minimum, about 20 as a maximum. Not everything is very long, some are just little ten second moments, others are a couple minutes, but it’s constant. Plus at each moment of contact, I’m leading her, wooing her, dominating her and gaining her compliance. Which makes going to bed and getting sex very easy for me.
At this point, it’s not even me consciously running game on Jennifer. I’m just “goofy and groping” with her. It’s light and playful and she knows that I can make a pass at her in the kitchen and not suddenly start trying to wrestle her to the ground. It’s so ingrained at this point that it would require a conscious decision to not act like this with her.
You also may like this post… Jedi Mind Pricks
“This will only take a minute, I promise you won’t feel a thing.”


  1. petesgamethoughts says:

    -10 points for the husband rushing into things and expecting sex straight away.

    But your demands for your sexual needs still have to be voiced.

  2. My husband is goofy and groping all the time. Sometimes even just stroking my fingers while we eat dinner sends the right message. His friends can't believe he has so much sex and that I'm willing all of the time.

    It's not every night. Sometimes we are both exhausted and fall asleep before anything can happen. But knowing that the next morning or evening is there for us makes those times less frustrating. In the entire time we've been together I can't remember a single time that either of us has denied the other physical intimacy, for any reason. We have arguments with each other and little things can irritate us, but sex is like the magic cure to bring us back together after a spat.

    People who don't "do it" don't experience the other benefits aside from physical gratification: the mental calm, the joy of a mate's touch, the refreshing sleep.

  3. Athol, this situation appears common and well worth highlighting as many ladies experience responsive desire and simply cannot sincerely say yes to sex before they start.

    Basically, a lot of ladies need warming up before even considering having sex – that means kissing and cuddling. I've met men who don't like kissing and cuddling, but the majority do, so its win win. Actually, I'd advise couples thinking of marrying to check out their compatibility in this regard. After 40 years, having to kiss and cuddle to get sex or fight for kisses and cuddles could get wearing.

    Anyway, perhaps the reader could talk with his wife about his feelings if he gets foreplay and no sex and get an agreement for a BJ or HJ if she does not want full sex afterall. This is what we do and we almost always end up with full sex.

  4. Most women cannot just fall into bed and be in the mood for sex. I know that's hard for a lot of men to understand – I've practically had to beg my husband to understand it. I can fall into bed and just have sex because he wants to – that's okay once in a while, but most times he would like for me to be into it too – and so would I. So the things that Athol and the readers mentioned are critical – you have to build up interest and anticipation through physical touch, sexy comments or sexting, a little bit of Alpha, etc. Just light, fun, sexy stuff throughout the day. It's not difficult, and you will probably enjoy it too. Also, if your wife isn't in the mood because she's exhausted (demanding little kids, demanding job, whatever) you need to help her get some rest and relaxation, because it's very difficult for an exhausted woman to get in the mood.

  5. Anonymous says:

    Something guys should know – at least about moms of little kids – is that someone is touching us *all the time*. We have to run that touch (sometimes very intimate touch) through the software called "Mommy" in order for it to be interpreted correctly.

    Most of us need some mental and/or physical time to change operating systems over to "sexy wifey". You will very commonly see, in advice for women about how to feel sexier, the advice to go take a special shower alone with candles (or something similar) before "go time".

    This is not a test. This is not a "we really don't want to". We just need to get into that headspace, and the headspace is vital for us.

    Athol's strategy of touching his wife throughout the evening playfully helps his wife get into that headspace seamlessly. Kissing and cuddling and slowly warming her up does the same thing.

  6. Wait, so he blew her off because he wasn't in the mood to cuddle, and she wanted to cuddle because she wasn't in the mood for sex… and female sexuality is responsive.

    From personal experience: Him climbing on top of me with a raging boner when I'm already half-asleep = no, or bad sex. Him coming to bed when I want to cuddle = 15min of cuddling + awesome sex.

    Sometimes I say "I want to cuddle" because I'm a little horny. Other times because I really do just want to cuddle. Regardless, 9/10 ends in awesome sex. The other 1/10 ends in average sex.

    Essentially, I'm using the word "cuddle" to replace the word "foreplay" because my beau thinks "foreplay" is to make a beeline for my crotch, without any other touching or kissing. Projecting much?

  7. Anonymous says:

    I want to be a fun/sexy/confident wife who stands up tall, flaunts her figure, rocks her lingerie, etc. But when I don't get any fun/sexy/hot touch from my husband except when we're in bed, it has a very bad effect on me. I stop feeling like fun/sexy/confident wife and start closing down sexually. It's a weird feeling, and it took me a long time to figure out what caused it. So husbands, you probably need to do a little work throughout the day to make sure that you have fun/sexy/confident wife. But it's not hard work, it's fun stuff. Read Athol's book if you don't know how to do it.

    Anon at 11:26 – very good point about mothers of young children. Mine are a little older now, and I had forgotten about having little people touching you all day – and then not wanting to be touched anymore! So husbands, you have to help your wife make the transition from mommy to sexy wife – don't be just another toddler she whose needs she has to meet!

  8. Perhaps Reader's wife is like me in her need to connect before engaging in intimate acts. Since their child had just been put to bed, I will assume that not much adult interaction had occurred that day. Cuddling (in my lexicon this means lying with arms around each other) in bed could have relaxed her enough to start talking. And talking is how women connect! Goofy and groping may work for a couple like this sometimes (although I admit that I hate groping but we are talking personal preference here) but it will never meet THAT need (i.e. her need to connect emotionally and mentally). When does that part come in?

    (I have read the whole archive of this blog and this is the one issue I have never understood.)

  9. Anonymous says:

    Working mom here as well. I am usually totally exhausted at night by the time the kids are in bed so I often initiate in the morning-I can't fight my own body clock. My husband no longer gets hurt feelings or pissed if I say "morning" because he knows I will deliver on that. That doesn't mean it never happens at night, it can, or also mid-day if the kids are all out of the house, or occupied with something and we can lock the door for a bit.

  10. Anonymous says:

    Meg @ 11:27

    LOL. Words for the wise-"foreplay is not making a bee line to my crotch".

  11. Standup Guy says:

    Maybe some of the readers can explain this to me. I just do not understand how it happens that you get married and pledge eternal love to your mate (to have and to hold and all that). Then after the kid(s) come into the picture, the spouse becomes a second class citizen in the home.

    My wife and I have two kids, my wife has a career, makes as much money as me. We are both busy, etc etc. I do my share of housework and the like.

    But regardless of that, I make it pretty clear that it is not OK for her to be at my kids beck and call, playing taxi to them and their friends at all hours of the day and then complain that there is no time or energy for me and sex.

    Shouldn't the marriage be a higher priority than taking Jonny to soccer or Megan to volleyball practice?

    Why does that house need to be spotless or the lawn perfectly groomed while the spouse sits and fumes over the lack of attention? I've seen people treat their pets better than their spouse. Why even get married?

    Am I oversimplifying this issue? Isn't it really just as easy as the spouses asking each other to make the marriage THE most important priority?

  12. Standup Guy – You're right, this behavior by women is hard to understand. And yes, the spouse and the marriage should be a higher priority than the kids' activities, friends, etc. I think that some women feel guilty (and maybe don't realize it) about working full time and are trying to "make up for it" by meeting all of their kids' perceived needs. Or they're concerned about what other people will think if they don't have their kids in every activity (a strange sort of "keeping up with the Joneses.") Or they've just gotten "stuck" in this pattern of frantic activity, running from work to school to soccer to piano, and on and on. I'm working on a blog idea that will focus on women having balance in their lives, and two of the things I want to nag women about are creating/maintaining intimacy with their husbands and not letting children's activities take over their lives.

    I'm not sure of the best approach for a man who finds himself in this situation. I think you should keep talking about it, not arguing or nagging but repeatedly making the point that the current situation is not acceptable to you. You also might want to start working Athol's MAP – although some parts of it are a little dark for my taste (!), I can't argue that it is likely to get a wife's attention.

  13. Athol Kay says:

    But regardless of that, I make it pretty clear that it is not OK for her to be at my kids beck and call, playing taxi to them and their friends at all hours of the day and then complain that there is no time or energy for me and sex.

    This is exactly right and good leadership.

    Now just imagine a guy doesn't do this for 5-6 years and digs himself a vast hole of wifely sexual disinterest in him.

  14. Standup Guy says:

    People, Women in particular have a difficult time saying no to all of demands on their time. Here is a trick

    that can help out with that. Everytime someone asks my wife to do something her answer is "I have to ask my husband". Doesn't matter what the activity is, happy hour, some volunteer thing with the church, give the kids a ride anywhere, can a kids friend come over to our house. The answer is always the same, "I have to ask my husband".

    This gives her a chance to
    1. think about whether she really wants to do the activity or not.
    2. get my input on it. Most of the time I would rather her NOT do the activity. How am I going to have sex with her if she is not home?
    3. Think of a way to say no to whoever is asking.

    I give my wife full permission to blame me for not being able to do the activity. That way she can say no without insulting whoever wanted her to do the activity. I do not care what her friends think of me.

    Some of the anxiety and guilt women feel stems from the husbands lack of direction setting. If you knew that your husband wanted you home instead of all the other activities that add little value to the marriage, wouldn't that make your decision make process easier?

  15. Anonymous says:

    Standup Guy is 100% right. You can guilt us into …well, way too much. Did y'all not know that we all feel horrible about not having our children exposed to every conceivable enrichment activity, while simultaneously feeling guilty that they don't get to romp in sunshine filled fields of grass exploring nature with a pile of (perfect, always polite) friends of exactly the same age? Yes. We obssess about being perfect Mommies all.the.time. Lots and lots of guilt there.

    It is SO EASY to rest on your husband's will, once you get the knack of it.

    Then you come and say, "You're such a good mommy, our kids are so lucky. And… yumm… is that a new perfume? I think I might want to explore that later… (insert neck nuzzle here)."

  16. Standup Guy says:

    Anon: 11:42.
    Yep. that is precisely the result I am going for.

  17. petesgamethoughts says:

    @Standup Guy
    I'm not married. Just enough relationship experience to understand what you're going through.

    Just a few points:
    1. Game better (this includes hitting the gym). Your game should be good enough that you shouldn't be ignored. Set up a frame where she wants to impress you. Lightly tease her, be playful, be dominant, text her to ask what colour her panties are during the day. Grab her as she walks past, kiss her deeply and push her off you. (You don't do it to get anything, you do it for fun) There is always time for sex. She just has to be in the mood for it.

    2. Voice your concern about not spending enough intimate time in your marriage and her spending a lot of time with the kids.(Without being needy. Touch on it quickly and leave it for her to think about) When she gives you sexual attention, tell her how good it feels when she gives you a HJ/BJ.

    3. If it gets bad enough, start scheduling in time to be intimate, talk, have a grope and a makeout on the couch.

    4. Read Athol's book.

  18. Standup Guy says:

    If these steps don't work/improve things, I would be shocked.

    Especially #3. My wife knows what to expect EVERY Friday afternoon. It's on her calendar. Come hell or highwater, I am going to get some AT LEAST ONCE A WEEK.

    The scheduling of sex makes it (as Athol says) the default. If you schedule it, your sweetie needs to give you a reason that she could NOT do it.

    The predictability of that schedule helps a lot of people. It re-affirms what is important in your life.

    Every one of us has a finite amount of time and energy. Scheduling that "date" helps us keep the important things at the top of the priority list.

  19. Standup Guy says:

    One other thing Pete, even if you are in a long term relationship, do not quit trying to game the ladies.

    Your sex rank goes up in your GF's eyes when that cute woman from work you have been chatting up waves at you as you and your GF are walking out of the grocery store, mall, wherever.

    Keep practicing your flirt skills on your GF and other women. Your GF is a smart person. She will enjoy your improved game skills, but will also recognize that if you can game her, you can game other women too.

    This all sounds pretty cold and calculating. But it's not. There is a positive reinforcing dynamic that can strengthen your bond. Your sex rank goes up. Then your GF starts dressing better to compensate. You hit the gym. The the GF loses a little weight.

    Before you know it, you both are improving together. It's awesome when you can feed off of your mate's energy like that.

  20. petesgamethoughts says:

    "My wife knows what to expect EVERY Friday afternoon. It's on her calendar. Come hell or highwater, I am going to get some AT LEAST ONCE A WEEK." – Too much focus on #3

    This isn't intended to insult, but that sounds like such a taking mentality. Like a rule. Like sex is an object: "One a week, my wife will give sex to me" That doesn't sound very sexy to me, and I don't think she will be very into it either. She'll do it out of compliance. Try giving love without expecting anything in return. Focus on #1 more.


  21. Standup Guy says:

    @Pete: not forced at all. It's just a regular date that we look forward to. Kids are at school. We can be lazy and take a nap afterwards or sometimes we grocery shop together. Married people stuff. It's great.

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