New Rule: Funerals and Reunions

New Rule: If there’s a funeral, and there’s out of state travel involved, either you both go, or you both stay home. Same deal with reunions too I’d say. You both go or you both stay home.

Let’s just say I’ve had this post floating around for a couple weeks and I’ve written it out a couple times and deleted just as many. I had a quite angry couple of days on behalf of someone I know and that’s about all I’m willing to say.  Not even a “five minutes of Alpha” deal either. That would have made so much more sense.

If anyone wants to complain about my “paranoia” about cheating, lets just say this one was pretty much out of the blue and even I was kinda shocked. I really would like to think the best of people, but some days they disappoint me.

Anyway, I keep writing and ranting and deleting. So that’s about it. Good grief I hate the mess cheating causes.

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Comments

  1. TLM says:

    Will Ferrells Chas speech about chicks being so horny with grief at funerals in The Wedding Crashers comes to mind. Meatloaf! We want it now!

    Your advice should already be common knowledge. Reunions especially. It ain’t rocket science.

  2. 3legdog says:

    Yup. Happened to me. Within the last two years my wife went alone out of state for both a funeral and a HS reunion. Both with my “You go honey, I’ll hold down the fort/kids/job” sendoff. Her cheating ensued and we are now going through a “high conflict” divorce.

  3. ZLX1 says:

    I hate it too. I hate it with everything I got.

    It’s so frustrating when you warn people away from it and they go ahead and blow up their lives and their kids lives anyway. For what? Nothing, that’s what. Not a God damned thing worth doing that for. Just walk away with clean hands if you’re at that point. Or if you have any doubt about your ability to control your penis or vagina, don’t leave the house without the spouse.

    Simple rule of thumb people: Never do anything that would make your kids ashamed of you if they found out about it. No Lolz. No Lolz at all on this topic.

  4. Badger says:

    I love people who tell that being “distrustful” is the cardinal sin of marriage, almost like it’s even worse than actually cheating on your spouse.

    I’m a pretty private person in real life and don’t like people nosing into my stuff. But I’m not so obtuse, delusional or solipsistic to think I’m not accountable to my partner for firewalling against high-risk situations. A phrase I like is “locks keep honest people honest.”

    Rollo Tomassi is the latest writer to take an attitude of “if she really wants to cheat on you, she’ll find a way to do it” as a justification for eschewing mate-guarding and reasonable monitoring. It’s a good point as far as it goes, but there’s one thing these people are missing in their argument: the people who DON’T “want to cheat” on their spouse, but are put (or put themselves) into situations where it’s either easy for someone to cheat if the mood strikes, or they are subject to intense temptations. The emotions of a funeral or a reunion can set either of those up as easily as a trip to booze- and titty-soaked Vegas or Mexico.

  5. Arlequin says:

    What an interesting post.

    I too have a similar story, although with a happy ending.

    Almost twenty years ago my wife’s uncle died in PA. We live in CA (spelled with a K).

    Despite the fact that my wife’s cousin was almost thirty years old, she felt too fragile to fly back on her own and my wife, a few years younger, was asked to fly with her.

    I felt the whole idea was rubbish and felt very uncomfortable about the idea considering we had two young children and couldn’t afford the $1,000 airfare, but being completely betaized and pussy-whipped by Women’s Lib, I let her go.

    Cousin was very pretty, blonde, always had a perm and always went to great lengths to make sure her hair and nails were perfect; tight-fitting, short dresses; makeup; fuck-me pumps, the whole nine yards.

    My brunette wife (I’ve always been a sucker for brunettes, not to stay I haven’t dallied with a few blondes, but mostly brunettes) was just as beautiful, but not one fourth as vain.

    Interestingly my wife is still very pretty, just twenty years older, but the cousin looks like she’s aged thirty years and was rode hard and put up wet.

    Which she was. I don’t remember if she was stepping out on her husband and three kids at that point, but she was shortly after that. This went on for years and amazingly she and her husband put it all back together, after a few visits to jail (for both of them) and losing their house.

    Now they have a grandkid and seem to be happy together. Weird.

    Anyway, the trip to PA happened. The funeral happened. A trip to a bar happened.

    Floozy cousin, being a drunk floozy, was attracting unwanted attention (as far as my wife was concerned) and she ended up telling the jerk to back off, which he did.

    When I heard the story I was little uneasy and a lot angry (OK, a lot of BOTH). I was glad to get her back without any unfortunate incidents (And yes, I do believe her. One thing we’ve always had in our relationship is honesty. Sometimes it is brutally painful, but generally it is reassuring and strengthing.)

    Being a few years older, and more experienced (and I hope a little bit enlightened), and more assertive, there is no way in hell I would let that happen again: funeral (emotions running wild); alcohol (liquid libido); drunk, horny a-holes just looking for a place to park their penises. Nope.

    I trust my wife completely, but I sure as hell don’t trust ninety percent of the OTHER guys out there. And I’m probably being generous at that.

    I know that subconciously at least, I KNEW why it was a bad idea for her to make that trip, but at that point in our marriage I sadly wasn’t in control enough to stop it.

    I hope to provide my kids with one last lesson, perhaps the most important lesson, when their lives transition into marriage: How husbands and wifes are SUPPOSED to behave.

    **********
    3legdog, I’m very sorry to hear about your situation. I hope you don’t get totally screwed in your divorce, although sadly men don’t seem to stand much of a chance. If there was ever a good reason to kill all the lawyers, this might be it.

    **********
    Athol- Your story is very compelling. Good manners forbid me from asking, but monkey curiosity wins out every time.

    Can you flesh out the story a little, while being discreet?

    I sounds like the person who fell off the wagon was male?

    Female and no I can’t.

  6. Anacaona says:

    Now I feel less insane planning for the time when I will need a nanny I asked my husband what were the things he finds absolutely disgusting on a woman/girl and I will make sure the nanny has all of them and then some and of course I will try to make sure we only use it when both are out of the house or get a lesbian nanny or a manny.
    He thinks I’m crazy but then how many men had cheated with the nanny, regardless if she is hotter or younger than the wife?
    Like the triangle of fire that needs: : heat, fuel, and an oxidizing agent to avoid a fire you only need to remove one ingredient.
    In the case of triangle of cheating is: Spouse/mate, attraction, occasion/opportunity. I’m not single and you cannot know who is attracted to who at all times, so the only thing left to control for is occasion/opportunity and I will be damned if I don’t control for that knowing that cheating is a deal-breaker for me.
    Good post. Is not paranoia if they are out to get you. ;)

  7. pdwalker says:

    You’re absolutely 100% correct on this one.

  8. AlmostAnonymous says:

    Anacaona:

    We are fortunate enough to have a “domestic helper” and have had several over the years

    My wife picks the ugliest ones she can find.

  9. riversong says:

    Completely agree about the nanny thing. Always makes me think of the expression ‘the hand that rocks the cradle rules the world’. Essentially, hotter or not, the nanny is often displaying all of the high value feminine traits (childcare, housework, cooking, tending to the family) and she is doing it all with a big smile on her face (because she is getting paid!). Also, as this is her profession, she is often excellent at all of it, never complains about any of it, and is never seen in any of those less than flattering moments. Nanny screams high risk to me, so I would definitely be thinking manny or seriously unattractive.

    Also completely agree about out of state trips (or within state trips actually). My big problem is that my career demands some national and international travel. Whenever possible, my husband will come with me, but that is a very expensive solution because my company will only pay my costs and he cannot keep taking time off from his job. Refusing to travel would impact on my career and giving up my career is not really an option. I try to be completely transparent about all travel and check in regularly, but it still causes a few difficulties. Sigh. I might post over on the forum to see if anyone has any advice on how to deal with this.

  10. Liz says:

    Especially with funerals, I’d say (although both are true).

    If you’re going to a funeral, then there’s a good chance that you’re vulnerable and grieving. That means that you’re more open to someone else’s moves. You’re also more open to someone insinuating (or saying outright) that your spouse is a heel for staying home instead of comforting you in your difficult time. Your spouse might be taking care of your 5 children, your dementia ridden mother and working to pay the mortgage etc. That won’t matter if you’re vulnerable, the other person is hot and you can justify it with a “what happens in Vegas…” mentality.

  11. Jacquie says:

    When I was much younger and would be out driving late I’d hear the standard be careful lecture. “Nothing will happen; don’t you trust me?” I would ask and the usual reply was, “I trust you, it’s the other driver I don’t trust.” The same could be applied here, you can’t trust who might be lurking waiting for an opportunity. With the right conditions even the best spouse could be broadsided and in the aftermath the hamster is going to go wild. A cornered hamster is vicious and will attack anyone who is close to it. From there on things are a mess. It is far better to just not go out driving alone even in the most solid of relationships.

  12. Athol Kay says:

    @Badger – I think displaying a lack of fear that she will cheat is a good thing. But it has to be coupled with total confidence you can replace her. So Rollo might get away with that, but an average husband learning game is just asking to be cheated on if he tries the same sort of move. Mate guarding is totally normal across mammals and most certainly primates and you ignore that at your peril.

  13. Ian Ironwood says:

    While I tend to agree with Athol on this one, modern life has made this approach impractical for some.

    Mrs. Ironwood has to travel occasionally for her job — it used to be all the time. We used the ff miles from the 52 trips she made in 2009 to buy airfare to Disney for the whole family, she was gone that much. While her present position doesn’t have near that much travel (she took a 40% pay cut so she could be at home more) she still attends several conferences where she has to be the de facto Business Development (“sales”) representative for her organization. That means bars, clubs, drinks, free drinks, dancing, etc. She has to smile and be “on” and look like she’s having a good time while she works the room.

    Now, Mrs. I’s parents were both in sales, and she can work a room like a $1000 a night hooker. She’s very good at what she does. She’s also very, very sensitive to how much alcohol is flowing, and she takes great pains to ensure that she stays far under her limit (usually by bribing the bartender to give her one Cuba Libre and then three cokes with lime before the next one. He charges the dudes buying the drinks full price and probably pockets the difference — everyone is on an expense account, so no one cares). She’s usually adept at that sort of thing, and by the end of the night she only has a mild buzz while her competitors are puking in the bushes.

    But as careful as she is, she can’t control the situation all the time, and she knows it. She’s been hit on by drunken colleagues more than once, people she thought incapable of such things. But she tells me about each time it happens and we discuss it — particularly the business ramifications. That sort of thing can be valuable intelligence. Some of these dudes are handsome, far more good-looking than I am. That might make me insecure, and I won’t deny that I’ve had a flicker from time to time. But she deals with it appropriately: they get one “free pass”, meaning that she will discreetly tell them she’s married, not interested, and dude, you really need to go to your room…alone. And she never speaks of it, because she figures everyone has a moment of weakness from time to time, and they shouldn’t loose their marriage over it.

    If it happens twice, then she considers the matter settled: she doesn’t mind who she tells about the dude hitting on her. That has proved quite interesting in the past.

    There’s an old saying in sales and theater, “drunk and on the road don’t count”. We all know it counts very much, but plenty of folks will use that (or its collorary, “eatin’ ain’t cheatin’”) to rationalize their infidelities. When the people around you are in that mindset, things can get dicey.

    So how do I deal? I count on the fact that I can trust Mrs. I, after 20 years of faithful companionship, and she calls me every night she’s on the road. Sure, that’s not complete assurance, but…

    I also make sure to speak to her co-workers and colleagues I know and judge their accounts. So far I’ve never seen a shred of doubt or anxiety when I watch them. But I do watch, and listen.

    Since we both still live in the same town we grew up in, almost all of our funerals and reunions are local. And we do attend them together, where I find them an outstanding and fascinating opportunity to watch Game in action (and in inaction). But sometimes even my presence at an event isn’t enough. At her reunion she got hit on by a drunk dude while I was escorting her blind girlfriend to the bathroom (long story). The dude was persistant, was certain that Mrs. I would be lucky to hook up with him (he was popular in high school, she was a nerd), but she was firm.

    When he still wouldn’t relent, she pointed me out, standing by the ladies’ room.

    “See that man? He’s my husband, Ian. He works in porn. And there is not a damn thing your drunk ass can do to me that he can’t do far, far better than you ever could.” She said it loud and clear across the bar, and everyone in the vicinity broke out laughing at the dude. Burn.

    See why I love her? Righteous was the boning that evening. Nothing hikes up a wife’s libido than seeing just how far the “popular” kids in HS turned out…fat, forty, and failing, for the most part.

  14. PastorGeek says:

    The church organization that I am licensed through has a strict ethical guideline that as far as possible, you are never alone with the opposite gender unless it’s family or you’re married to them. I have abided by this rule for my entire marrage to Mrs. Geek and it has given us both much comfort. And never council a woman without your wife present at all times. Worth it for the lack of drama.

  15. Wald says:

    Trust, but verify.

    @Badger – I think Rollo’s advice is more applicable to long term relationships, whereas Athol’s advice on this matter is more applicable for marriage.

  16. Shanna says:

    Wow, I would have never thought of a funeral as a risky scenario, but now that everyone’s expanded upon the emotional vulnerability it all makes sense. I’ve let my husband go alone to those several times.
    Hmm, maybe no more.

    Reunions? NO WAY in HALE I would let my husband go without me. I have never seen so many women on the prowl as I did at my high school reunion. Lots of girls that were nerds/ invisible in high school showing off their new boobs.

  17. Paul A'Barge says:

    I’ve let my husband go alone to those several times.

    Let?

    How’s that beta male working out for you, again?

  18. Wendy says:

    @ Anacaona: “Now I feel less insane planning for the time when I will need a nanny….”

    A few years ago, I also let go of a babysitter based simply on her looks. (I did not tell her this of course, it was all completely diplomatic LOL!) But , at the end of the day, she was my age, cute and had a better rack than me. Something about her picking up my child right in front of my husband with said nice rack nicely on display (she always wore flattering tops, sometimes quite low cut) did not sit well with me. Call me crazy!

  19. DanG says:

    I have a cousin who was conceived at a funeral. Now at age 40ish, she still does not know who her father is. Her mother would never tell her.

  20. Anacaona says:

    My wife picks the ugliest ones she can find.

    I don’t trust ugly is safe anymore. My Cad friends sometimes picked to cheat on their wives with ugliest women as a way to make sure it will never be more than a pump and dump because their wives were hotter so they wouldn’t trade. That is cheater’s mentality and then you have Schwarzenegger’s lovechild momma and you can see ugly is not enough. I’m picking unattractive on the ways I know my husband gets a bone killer (he does has some types that he cannot stand being on the same room thank goodness) just to be on the safe side of things.

    I might post over on the forum to see if anyone has any advice on how to deal with this.

    Next year I will be taking the kid to meet their grandparents in a very long trip. I will be reading that post too. I mean hubby and I meet online and dealt with distance before with no problems but then that was before we were married and he saw that I’m human and I can fart and all the illusions of the “perfect woman I’m going to marry” has been lost, and he will see me nursing and covered on baby poo he had never cheated before neither have I but yeah I’m still paranoid.

    “See that man? He’s my husband, Ian. He works in porn. And there is not a damn thing your drunk ass can do to me that he can’t do far, far better than you ever could.” She said it loud and clear across the bar, and everyone in the vicinity broke out laughing at the dude. Burn.

    Heh I like your wife :)
    I’m usually very nice but nothing bring the bitch more than a stubborn man that doesn’t take a no for an answer specially if I’m not single “What kind of whore he thinks I am?” Burned on the stake, idiot.

  21. AlmostAnonymous says:

    Anacaona:

    And I mean ugly, bless them. Waaaaaaaaay below anything I’d ever consider regardless of the amount of alcohol consumed. When my wife would comment, “she’s nice, what do you think?” I know it’s time to exit the mine field gracefully.

    Ian,

    Could you pass on a high five from an anonymous poster? I laughed my ass off over what she said. You have a fine woman.

  22. Anacaona says:

    Call me crazy!

    We should start a club! :D
    At least we are so busy being paranoid that is very unlikely that we ever cheat. The times I had been propositioned after being married my first though is “I wonder if the husband is getting hit on too?” and then call him to say “I love you” there are upsides of being this crazy ;)

  23. Lorax says:

    Athol, I love the book, and am benefiting greatly from it. Thank you for writing it.
    But this….

    Him: “Hey Babe, my aunt died. Funeral is this week in ____ state.”
    Her: “No, I’m not going and that means you’re not going either.”

    And this is 100% based on pure distrust of me screwing around while I’m gone?
    Uh, no.
    This is the exact kind of thing that makes me recoil from the very idea of marriage.
    This lack of trust.
    Keeping me *from family at a funeral*!!! because of her insecurity?
    And worst of all, acting like some authority that tells me where and what I can and can’t do, because she said so, because of *her* issues??!

    The very first thing I would think is, “Wow, I’m really with the wrong woman. She was great at first and now she’s showing her true, controlling and insecure self. Damn, I really like(d) her. Of course you don’t just throw something like this away, and I’ll try to reason with her. But if this is how its going to be, she’s got to go.”

    Control is insidious and will creep into a relationship and kill it. First you cave on this, and next on the chopping list is poker night with the guys. Your woman slowly gets a little too comfortable playing Warden. This sort of thing creeps in like the tide or the slow hand on a clock: you can’t really perceive it from moment to moment, but eventually things are completely opposite. Seen it, lived it. Never again. You’ve got to stop it the moment she tries. I consider it a huge shit test from her, and a red flag lit up like a Christmas tree coming from her.

    I really feel bad for the married people out there whose spouses keep them on lockdown like this.
    Maybe its just me but this level of control is a dealbreaker.
    Life is too short to be kept on some insecure person’s leash.

  24. Athol Kay says:

    @Lorax – It’s less of a control thing and more of an extra couple of hundred bucks for a second plane ticket buys you a lot of piece of mind thing.

    It’s not about distrust as much as it is understanding human nature. You’re going to have half the couple completely out of reach of the other, with an emotional circumstance, add in some drinks afterwards, an old friend actively trying to seduce and a hotel room. That’s just setting the stage for a critical failure. We all have moments of weakness.

    When I went to New Zealand to say goodbye to my dad in 2010, I knew being without Jennifer during an emotional time + reasonably priced and completely legal prositution was going to be a genuine temptation to me. So I asked Jennifer to come with me. Gotta know your limits. It’s not about control, it’s about self-control and keeping the thing of value safe.

    Couple hundred bucks. Get on the damn plane. Might save you tens of thousands in the long run.

  25. toomanypasswords says:

    It’s a good rule for reunions, though not always very practical. Went to my HS reunion by myself a couple years ago and had a good time – much better than if my wife had come with me, since she would have been bored to tears at a reunion where she knew hardly anyone.

    Toward the end of the night, I saw a classmate who made it clear she was interested in me. My first clue of her interest was she “accidentally” brushed her breasts against me about 5 times. I admit I thought about taking her up on her offer, but decided to call it a night before trouble could ensue.

    Straying after a funeral sounds morbid to me – can’t imagine myself being tempted there.

  26. Mike says:

    How about weddings?

    Absolutely.

  27. Mike M. says:

    I’m reminded of G. Gordon Libby – who wrote that when he came to Washington, he needed a secretary. There were many applicants, most of whom were quite attractive.

    He picked a grandmother in her 60s. And claimed it was a brilliant move. Not only did it avoid temptation and associated unfortunate consequences, it got him a secretary who was extremely competent. So much so that when she retired, Liddy got another grandmother as a replacement.

  28. The Dude says:

    Especially weddings…the chances of cheating at weddings is 100 times greater than reunions. Think about what is in the air.

  29. Candice says:

    Athol – I feel for your friend and the family involved and know we think somewhat differently. I applaud your self awareness and action to make sure you maintained self control.

    I always go for the positive approach. I’d say going with your partner on trips out of state etc and to funerals is the nice thing to do. We really need to support each other and create mutual and bonding memories.

    That said, lack of trust would wreck my relationship. It would also be impractical to keep tabs on each other all the time. The realities of modern life and business mean that couples are often apart.

    My advice based on my own situation is thus:
    * Don’t waste the rest of your life controlling your partner or being kept on a leash. it’s a form of domestic abuse.
    * Do have a fantastic home, relationship and family.
    * Weddings – always take a partner – husband if married, male friend if no man in your life.
    * Funerals – take a support person. However, organise so you can freely mingle. Funerals are often the only time you can catch up with long not seen relatives.
    * Reunions – go by yourself or with some friends from the old days. A spouse will just get in the way unless you want to show them off!

    Oh …and … employing older people is a great idea in any situation! Agism sucks!!!
    :-) C

    The “support” person was the problem. Likewise he trusted her to go when apparently he shouldn’t have. It’s pretty standard that a wife will shame a husband for lack of trust to give herself space to cheat on him.

  30. BlackCat says:

    We are fortunate enough to have a “domestic helper” and have had several over the years
    My wife picks the ugliest ones she can find.

    Well, that certainly worked for Maria.

  31. Been there, done that says:

    Athol,

    Was the support person the same sex as the wife or was the support person male ?, and did the wife shame the husband for his lack of trust, ie does it appear that the wife was setting up a potential scenario with the support person so that they could have the opportunity as per the triangle of cheating outlined by Anacoana ?

  32. Kort says:

    The more I learn, the more I think my parents are absolutely abnormal, but I also know that a lot of work went on behind the scenes in their marriage. For about 3 years, my parents both traveled constantly. They went out of their way to arrange to meet if they were going to be near each other or to pick a city that was between them if it was closer than going home. My mom lost her job due to “restructuring” but my dad still has to travel (usually 2 weeks in the field “office”-usually a shack in the middle of some kind of field, 1 week at home). We’re all glad my mom stopped traveling as much because about 6 months earlier, the doctor found a hole in her heart and suggested she stop traveling. She still has to go out of town occasionally to care for her aging parents but it’s not nearly as much.

    Funny story: My parents went to see Up In The Air and really didn’t like it. Afterwards, my mom said it had never occurred to her to cheat while she was on the road and my dad concurred. The road wasn’t different, it was just where you had to be until you got home, and home was with each other.

    What my parents did:
    They talk constantly and my dad taught my mom how to use Skype.
    My mom is a work-a-holic.
    My dad works with almost all men and doesn’t drink.
    Neither of them suffer fools lightly and value their marriage above everything.
    If they got bored, they shopped for their kids and grandchildren and enjoyed having money to spend. It was never a lot (well, except for the tuba my dad bought me for Christmas a few years ago) but it kept them focused on family and off potential distractions.

    Hope that helps some of the people concerned about traveling!

  33. Duncan says:

    @ Wendy: Not crazy at all; you absolutely did the right thing. Husbands bang nannies. I’ve seen the scenario play out more than once.

  34. This is Jen says:

    I would never have worried about my husband going to a funeral alone. Actually we were trying to arrange for him to get across the country for one about 2 weeks ago. We couldn’t get it worked out, tho. call me crazy, but even after reading all this, I still wouldn’t give it a moments thought.

  35. ZLX1 says:

    @ Candice

    You said: “* Reunions – go by yourself or with some friends from the old days. A spouse will just get in the way unless you want to show them off!”

    Run hamster, run.

    Seriously? You believe that behavior is ‘safe’ so to speak for a marriage?

    Oh of course it is. What was I thinking? I forgot that you “trust” each other and if your hubby doesn’t trust you enough to let you go to a class reunion by yourself with the old crew of pals then he’s a controlling jerk and he has issues right? ROFL.

    The Lolz!!!! They always come out at night.

  36. shibari says:

    Some nights ago, kids asleep we enjoyed a mild august night and talked about crushes & infidelity. We chatted about the chemical stuff like dopamine, oxytocine etc. and how it explained the somewhat rough times we experienced just after we met 17 years ago. We talked about crushes, bonding and the “I need space” talk. We talked about her upcoming yearly job-related conference in september, where she would meet the AUSTRIAN GUY and whether it would be safe to let her go. The austrian guy is a (not too happily) married guy she met 3 times over the last 10 years. She is quite fascinated by him, called him kind of a “soulmate” and said that he could be “dangerous” for her, if he wouldn’t live some 600 miles away in good old Vienna. They had exchanged emails for years, one of which accidentally landed in my inbox on our jointly used laptop. I therefore know that this guy definitely wants to get into my wife’s panties, and that he had cheated on his wife before – repeatedly. My wife knows that I know.
    My wife joked that if she would actually join the conference, she would have to behave, because just a week later on my own yearly conference, I will meet the SEXY SCIENTIST in a romantic hotel, where we likely will have some cocktails. The sexy scientist is a super bright, good looking female colleague with a perfect humour (when asked in high school about the 2 most important things on our future spouses, I answered “humour and intelligence”). I usually can’t stand my personal space being invaded, but she ist one of the few people I feel comfortable to let me touch, hug and even kiss (well – peck, rather). She ist tall and curvy, with long shiny hair, endless legs and a waist-hip ratio beyond amazing (a narrow waist is my main eyecatcher on a woman). She pushes an even fatter button with me because I know by chance that she is also quite kinky sexually, but we did never discuss this. There is only some innuendo like talk about slaves (interns) catering to our special needs (x-ray spectroscopy). At work she is usually super busy and we don’t talk much, but on last years conference, we talked for quite some time in the cocktail bar late at night, and after 3 or 4 cocktails, she closed in and started to touch me repeatedly (she is divorced, BTW). When I noticed the dopamine kicking in, I finished my drink, said goodbye and went to bed. My wife knows her and she had quite a laugh when I told her the story. I am still at good terms with the SEXY SCIENTIST…

    Reading Athols sad story with the funeral and all the other cheating stuff, it should be absolutely clear that none of us should be allowed to join the upcoming conferences. On the other hand, all of this seems quite futile to me because – let’s face it – for both of us it would be ridiculously easy to cheat anyway. My wife works odd hours and has infrequent meetings all over the county with numerous people I am not supposed to know anything about, by law (highly confidental). Hell, she can just pay a visit to an old friend of us from college, a married girl who would not hesitate a second when asked to provide an alibi or cover my wife’s ass in some other way. My wife is high in demand and gets hit upon every now and then. Plus, over years my wife repeatedly has had minor crushes on musicians. She plays in a philharmonic orchestra as an amateur, and during projects she is surrounded by musicians for long and unpredictable hours, severaly days in a row. The orchestra does travel oversea like tours to Paris or China. Talk about attraction and opportunity…
    I on the other hand, work together with a girl who pushes almost all of my buttons, lives conveniently near the research facility (which for me is 50 miles away) and shows clear interest. I am used to change clothes and shower at work, as I work long hours in cleanroom environment. It’s difficult to contact me via phone during daytime, as I am forced to change locations often and usually do not even have cellphone connection (high security labs). Sometimes I am forced to stay overnight on short notice. I can enter and leave the facility at will and unnoticed, as does she. I seem to be in high demand too because apart from the sexy scientist, I have been hit upon repeatedly by other girls, sometimes especially for kinky stuff (as usually, I declined, even during the sexless years in our marriage).
    I do understand the new rules regarding funerals, weddings, high school reunions and so on and feel really sad about all the cheating I read about all the time. But sometimes, I guess, the old borg saying is true: “Resistance is Futile”. I guess I’ll let her go. Without trust, this will not work out for us. Time will tell.

  37. enlightened1 says:

    Shibari:
    Sounds like you’ve thought this one through quite thoroughly….hmmm

  38. Trimegistus says:

    Okay, I’m just mystified. I can absolutely understand cheating at weddings — there’s the stag party/doe party the night before which involves booze, strippers, and pub-crawling. There’s the reception with other people’s cute relatives or old friends, more booze, and a general air of good-natured sleaziness.

    But funerals? Who are you going to wind up fucking — your cousins? Hunky undertakers?

    Old friends. A gentle arm around the shoulder. A hug. A surprise kiss…

  39. FeralFelis says:

    I’ve read all the stories. I’ve been cheated on by both husbands. The second husband had already cheated on his first wife, so I guess I should not have been surprised.

    Both cheated locally, during the day while they should have been at work, with non-coworkers.

    I have come to the conclusion that if someone’s going to cheat, it doesn’t matter where they are, what the circumstances are, or how “happy” they are in their marriage. Conversely, I know that because of what happened to me, there is NOTHING, NO ONE, NO HOW, NO WAY that would ever cause me to cheat. EVER.

    And when I’m in a relationship, I STILL trust my man to not cheat. I wouldn’t want to live any other way. I know I am being naive, but it’s the way I prefer to live. I do not want to live in fear.

  40. ZLX1 says:

    @FeralFelis

    You don’t live free from fear because of a forced sense of naivete. You can live free from fear because you have dealt with the situation twice before and survived it. It sucks, but you made it through. So that is why you don’t have to fear, because you know you can handle it if the worst stuff happens in the relationship.

    Now just stop picking dudes like that to hang with. Don’t stack the deck against yourself from the get go.

    Hey! Wait a minute!

    I just helped myself, or rather you and Dean helped me get to some additional thoughts on what I’ve been rambling all over about today. Thanks!

    I don’t have to live in fear of commitment about having a “real” relationship with a woman because I’ve been through the worst stuff that can be dished out by one (no really – the worst) and I didn’t die. I didn’t lose everything. I didn’t go out of business. I didn’t lose my kids. My life sucked for a bit, it hurt bad at times, but I made it through and matter of fact I’m doing better today than I ever was in many respects. Like – I’m not married to her. Oh, The Lolz!!! Serious though. Plus I also know I do quite dandy on my own. There is strength there in all of that hard won experience.

    So, hmm, if the reason I’m all down in my attitude on LTRs is because of a latent fear of having to go through this shit again (like the funeral post main topic), getting taken advantage of, or it not working out, WTF am I really afraid of? Some sucky times? Is that a big deal? Well in a way, yeah it is, but even if the worst should come to pass, it’s not gonna kill me or ruin me. It’ll just hurt for a bit and all but I’ll make it through and probably in faster time than the first experience. I know that. I know it in my bones because I lived it and I lived through it.

    Maybe, just maybe this hound is much wiser than the pup used to be so I could possibly say that I might be wise enough to make a better choice of companion. In other words, not stack the deck against myself from the word go this time.

    Well, by not taking a chance, I’m assured of getting NOTHING. I know that for a fact from business. No risk, no reward. Control the variables you can, make an informed decision, take decisive action and course correct as needed, bail when required and regroup or continue to reinforce success and build upon it.

    Lemme see – take a reasonable chance (play it smart – take a good risk, not play it foolish or fast and loose) with someone with the payoff potentially being something really good – or keep up this current stuff I’m doing which pretty much amounts to nothing much ventured, nothing much gained. (other than lolz, and some hay rolls)

    No blinders, no rose colored glasses, no pedestal, full awareness of the ugly side of human behavior, bullshit detector set to super-high, but still, get myself free to take a chance because I know, come what may, I can take it, because I had to do it before.

    I’m still not getting married, evah! You hear me!?! But I might try on a dedicated girlfriend for size. Better slow down though, think this through more. Don’t want to go all Disney, yet.

    What a weird blog post topic for me to coalesce these things I’ve been ruminating on regarding getting to where I can see myself in an LTR.

    Weird.

    (Hugz, Honk)

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